so these burger flippers really think they deserve $15 an hour???
konceptjones
New member
UPTOWNCONNEXX;6117503 said:
y'all young cats swear everything is "hating".
The job pays what it's worth. The only reason people are complaining is because they're trying to live off of a low wage job and can't. It's not a job to live off of, it's an entry level, bottom of the barrel part time job you get when you're in high school. I don't see why that's so hard for y'all to grasp. This is not a job to raise a family on. It NEVER was!
konceptjones
New member
UPTOWNCONNEXX;6117541 said:
bruh... Fast food has NEVER been a full time job.
EVER
Unless you're in management, you don't get 40 hours. It was like that when I did it in high school, it was like that in the 70's, it was like that in the 60's. There's always been that understanding that the shit ain't a 40hr/week job.
They're not "slashing hours", they weren't getting the hours in the first place!
You taking this shit awfully personal Uptown... Perhaps you're working in fast food?
Ole "Can I get a number 5 with cheese" nigga, "Drop fries and pies" ass nigga.
Don't let me call Chanita on yo ass.
ceothachosen1
New member
Matt-;6110948 said:
you sound real sheltered ever stop and think that maybe some people are so poor they can't afford to turn down a job?
desertrain10
New member
konceptjones;6126175 said:
Well duh...the point that ur missing is that adults with bills to pay are having to settle for these jobs because they either got laid off or and the lack of decent paying jobs thats out there
did u read any of the articles i posted that you requested
Smh
konceptjones;6126259 said:UPTOWNCONNEXX;6117541 said:
bruh... Fast food has NEVER been a full time job.
EVER
Unless you're in management, you don't get 40 hours. It was like that when I did it in high school, it was like that in the 70's, it was like that in the 60's. There's always been that understanding that the shit ain't a 40hr/week job.
They're not "slashing hours", they weren't getting the hours in the first place!
You taking this shit awfully personal Uptown... Perhaps you're working in fast food?
Ole "Can I get a number 5 with cheese" nigga, "Drop fries and pies" ass nigga.
Don't let me call Chanita on yo ass.
so what youre saying is mcdonald's has always made 5 billion in profit a year??? word son???
i dont work in fast food, and realistically sitting in an office all day answering a phone just because you took a loan out to go to college doesnt necessarily mean you deserve 15 dollars an hour either. how is it that you can judge what job is important based on what skill it takes to perform it??
just because you can do some thing that comes hard to alot of ppl, like computer programming for example, is not the reason the job pays well. its because you can demand more for your services being that not many ppl can supply it, thus making you valuable. but if your skills arent in demand then it wouldnt matter how hard your job is now would it?? but im sure you know about supply and demand, being that you have an important enough job title to look down on fast food workers.
so it works both ways ... if its an easy ass job but you have millions of customers coming thru on a daily basis (high demand), somebody has to man those jobs, and if they dont you will lose money. because surely trying to do that easy ass job yourself means you'd have to sacrifice your speedy service and a ton of other shit that makes your business successful. so in turn your employees are important and if the job is secure, meaning an employee knows that it will be there tomorrow because business is consistent, then why wouldnt they try and make a living off of it??
now ... if the general consensus is that no one would work for mcdonalds for less than $15/ hour, same way no nba league veteran will play for less than 1 million a season (even tho they arent as "important" as the stars on the team), then what will mcdonalds do?? lose a bunch of customers to chick fil a and burger king or pay them the money and take home a little less profit??
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kingblaze84
New member
konceptjones;6126259 said:UPTOWNCONNEXX;6117541 said:
bruh... Fast food has NEVER been a full time job.
EVER
Unless you're in management, you don't get 40 hours. It was like that when I did it in high school, it was like that in the 70's, it was like that in the 60's. There's always been that understanding that the shit ain't a 40hr/week job.
They're not "slashing hours", they weren't getting the hours in the first place!
You taking this shit awfully personal Uptown... Perhaps you're working in fast food?
Ole "Can I get a number 5 with cheese" nigga, "Drop fries and pies" ass nigga.
Don't let me call Chanita on yo ass.
LOL......that was fucked up man, but in the end you're right in that people should NOT be relying on Mcdonalds to pay the bills.....education is key to life, first comes the education, then comes the money then comes the power to demand and EARN it. I know times are VERY hard for many people out there but still, with a good education, one can make really good money. The college graduate unemployment rate now is 4% and most still make a decent to good wage (in many places)
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blakfyahking
New member
UPTOWNCONNEXX;6131096 said:
you just explained the problem with a minimum wage
and trust, if current workers aren't willing to work these jobs.........there are plenty of others for cheap
unless workers formally unionize..............but no fast food place is willing to take a union serious as long as a MW exists
Lil Loca;6131302 said:
uh.....no shorty the bolded is not true
what you just described in the bolded is inflation
of course corporations ignore economic hardships because they cut into profits..........the whole purpose of a business existing is to make money
conservatives often have a hard time agreeing with govt mandating the affairs of private individuals and organizations.........especially since govt mandates usually require usage of public dollars (more tax dollars)
konceptjones
New member
Lil Loca;6131844 said:blakfyahking;6131785 said:what you just described in the bolded is inflation
of course corporations ignore economic hardships because they cut into profits..........the whole purpose of a business existing is to make money
conservatives often have a hard time agreeing with govt mandating the affairs of private individuals and organizations.........especially since govt mandates usually require usage of public dollars (more tax dollars)
I learned this in my class. Yes, the minimum wage is expected to get higher to balance with the standard of living. You may call it inflation, but naturally, if the price of goods and services rise, the minimum wage will have to raise as well, because you want to continue the purchasing power of regular people.
Corporations may want to make as much money off of workers as they can, but if you continue to pay people low wages and the standard of living continues to rise, your economy will go in the toilet because no one will be able to afford being consumers, as they are falling deeper into poverty.
I already stated that current math placed the current minimum wage as 30% too low by historical standards. Minimum should be raised to about ~$9.50/hr.
konceptjones
New member
UPTOWNCONNEXX;6131096 said:konceptjones;6126259 said:UPTOWNCONNEXX;6117541 said:
bruh... Fast food has NEVER been a full time job.
EVER
Unless you're in management, you don't get 40 hours. It was like that when I did it in high school, it was like that in the 70's, it was like that in the 60's. There's always been that understanding that the shit ain't a 40hr/week job.
They're not "slashing hours", they weren't getting the hours in the first place!
You taking this shit awfully personal Uptown... Perhaps you're working in fast food?
Ole "Can I get a number 5 with cheese" nigga, "Drop fries and pies" ass nigga.
Don't let me call Chanita on yo ass.
so what youre saying is mcdonald's has always made 5 billion in profit a year??? word son???
show me where I ever said that.
That you graduated from college by itself is typically used as an indicator. But, just because you graduated doesn't mean that you're going to get much more than minimum. I had a friend that graduated college with a bachelors for social work. She applied for a job with the City of Detroit and got it, but when they sat her down to make an offer, they presented her a starting rate of $7.50/hr with a smile like "this is a good deal". At the time, minimum was $5.15/hr and I, with no degree, was making $9.50/hr (but I worked up to 55hrs a week) doing customer service for a mortgage company. Knowing what I made, she balked at it.
You made my point all by yourself and also contradicted yourself within two sentences.
Everyone and their momma can work fast food, thus the pay is extremely low. You watch a 15minute training video in the back room and you're behind the grill.
Jobs pay well for several reasons. Two reasons are in the bolded part. Jobs pay well because of the skill required to perform a task and because of the supply of people that are trained to perform that task. There was a point in time only a few years ago where entry level IT was near McDonalds status. In 2000, I got my first professional IT job on a helpdesk (the very same company I was a temp in customer service at). They pay rate was $15.87/hr. I got the job thanks to word of mouth from the desktop techs as being the "go to guy" in my department that everyone went to before calling IT for help.
5 years later, EVERYONE jumped into IT and the glut of people that could do the work drove entry level rates down to $10/hr in some cities with desktop techs suddenly needing A+, Network+, and vendor certifications just to make $13/hr.
Too many people capable of performing a task drives the rate of pay down.
Around that same time, the viability of offering your services as a PC tech to individuals via craigslist tanked. There was once a time when I could charge a decent, fair amount of money to build and repair pc's. When the heldesk/desktop tech market was overloaded, those people flooded Craigslist and started driving the rates down there.
Again, too many people capable of performing a task drives the rate of pay down.
With a fast food job, there's no such barrier to entry, all you need to be able to do the work is show up, thus the entry level pay is typically going to be minimum wage and will only be higher in areas where people don't want to work in fast food (i.e. upper middle class to wealthy areas). This is why fast food typically pays better in the suburbs: their kids usually don't want to work these jobs and the pay rate is increased to attract workers who usually come out there from other parts of a given metro.
@bolded because no one strives to be "entry level" all their lives.
A job that requires maybe 15-30 minutes of training (including hands-on time) to be proficient is an expendable job. Your employees are important, but because the job requires very little training invested in each employee, high turnover in those positions is acceptable AND just as there's a high demand from customers, there's also a never-ending line of people willing to work those jobs even if it means traveling to the burbs to do so.
For every person that says they won't work at McDonalds for less than $15/hr, there's a few immigrants that will do it for minimum.
kingblaze84
New member
This thread is a perfect example of why endless printing of paper and deficit spending is DISASTROUS for society in the long run. It ALWAYS fucks over the poor and lower middle class, since the cost of living will INEVITABLY get higher, as endless printing of money ONLY causes the dollar to become less and less in value. The Federal Reserve fucked over millions and generations of Americans by its endless printing the last twenty, thirty years. The misguided people who support this endless printing of monopoly money will be the same ones crying when less jobs are created as it becomes MORE AND MORE expensive to hire people.
Now imagine what the cost of living will be in ten, twenty years.......America, for most people, will become a borderline nightmare to live in within a generation, if not sooner. Thanks a lot Democrats and Republicans, both you guys have completely fucked over Americans for a very long time. America's obsession with endless wars and neverending spending has destroyed this nation. To those working in Mcdonalds and other fast food joints, I feel your pain, but no business owner is gona pay ya'll 15 an hour. To those with better jobs, hold on to your money and save. Cuz the cost of living is only gona go up......and up......and up......enjoy the ride folks.
Now imagine what the cost of living will be in ten, twenty years.......America, for most people, will become a borderline nightmare to live in within a generation, if not sooner. Thanks a lot Democrats and Republicans, both you guys have completely fucked over Americans for a very long time. America's obsession with endless wars and neverending spending has destroyed this nation. To those working in Mcdonalds and other fast food joints, I feel your pain, but no business owner is gona pay ya'll 15 an hour. To those with better jobs, hold on to your money and save. Cuz the cost of living is only gona go up......and up......and up......enjoy the ride folks.
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blakfyahking
New member
Lil Loca;6131844 said:blakfyahking;6131785 said:what you just described in the bolded is inflation
of course corporations ignore economic hardships because they cut into profits..........the whole purpose of a business existing is to make money
conservatives often have a hard time agreeing with govt mandating the affairs of private individuals and organizations.........especially since govt mandates usually require usage of public dollars (more tax dollars)
I learned this in my class. Yes, the minimum wage is expected to get higher to balance with the standard of living. You may call it inflation, but naturally, if the price of goods and services rise, the minimum wage will have to raise as well, because you want to continue the purchasing power of regular people.
Corporations may want to make as much money off of workers as they can, but if you continue to pay people low wages and the standard of living continues to rise, your economy will go in the toilet because no one will be able to afford being consumers, as they are falling deeper into poverty.
you actually have it backwards...........the price of goods and services rise as wages rise
remember that in a market economy, prices are based on demand
if standard wages are too low, then prices for goods and services will have to drop in order for a company to be able to sell its goods
so actually raising the minimum wage is an example of inflation because it encourages firms to raise prices for their goods
perfect example is look at college tuition............as the govt injects money to allow more people to go to college (increasing demand), colleges are able to get away with charging higher rates
if less people went to college, tuition rates would drop substantially
Lil Loca;6131919 said:
Fordism really has nothing to do with wages for the general public, only retaining internal employees...........it's a concept about manufacturing (and being able to make a product more cheaply so that it can be sold at a lower price to gain more customers)
Fordism actually contradicts your argument that wages need to be raised to afford common goods and services........cause Fordism is an example of a firm recognizing that it had to find a way to lower the price of its products to meet demand (consumer affordability)
so actually a capitalistic economy is better because it allow the ability to adjust for changes in wages/prices
blakfyahking
New member
@Loca
you are forgetting the effect of the "stickiness" of market prices
of course market prices stay at their current levels (or even go higher) because the market only expects wages to be low temporarily
the biggest impact is the influence of govt by added taxes and subsidies...........which explains college tuition even though wages have stagnated
Fordism applies to manufacturing firms especially when you consider that technology wasn't as prevalent and outsourcing wasn't as easy to do back then
so corporations recognized that they could pay higher wages cause less taxes meant they had more to spend on workers..........plus most of the buyers would be from the US
but now why would a corporation pay higher wages if they can pay someone in a 3rd world country pennies, then sell the product they made for dollars in several other countries
you can't compare the tenets of Fordism in a modern global economy in contrast to the US economy of the 40s - 70s
you are forgetting the effect of the "stickiness" of market prices
of course market prices stay at their current levels (or even go higher) because the market only expects wages to be low temporarily
the biggest impact is the influence of govt by added taxes and subsidies...........which explains college tuition even though wages have stagnated
Fordism applies to manufacturing firms especially when you consider that technology wasn't as prevalent and outsourcing wasn't as easy to do back then
so corporations recognized that they could pay higher wages cause less taxes meant they had more to spend on workers..........plus most of the buyers would be from the US
but now why would a corporation pay higher wages if they can pay someone in a 3rd world country pennies, then sell the product they made for dollars in several other countries
you can't compare the tenets of Fordism in a modern global economy in contrast to the US economy of the 40s - 70s
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perspective@100
New member
konceptjones;6126259 said:UPTOWNCONNEXX;6117541 said:
bruh... Fast food has NEVER been a full time job.
EVER
Unless you're in management, you don't get 40 hours. It was like that when I did it in high school, it was like that in the 70's, it was like that in the 60's. There's always been that understanding that the shit ain't a 40hr/week job.
They're not "slashing hours", they weren't getting the hours in the first place!
You taking this shit awfully personal Uptown... Perhaps you're working in fast food?
Ole "Can I get a number 5 with cheese" nigga, "Drop fries and pies" ass nigga.
Don't let me call Chanita on yo ass.
So I been reading through this thread... You seem pretty smart but you are wrong on quite a few levels. First, I'm speaking from experience of working at Mcdonalds for 3 months after graduating from college. The managers know the rules on giving hours but they bend them to their benefit. A hard worker such as myself at regular employee status sometimes received a 40 hour work weeks by accident and pure need for my services. Second you categorize a corporations ability to create a business off of what you call entry level jobs. That's not how it works. Once you join the team you are given the opportunity to progress up the ladder. Therefore, a person can and should assume that they will have the ability to make a living off getting a job at a fast food chain. The job was actually modeled on assembly line operations for efficiency. Unfortunately, they did not take the pay rate model.
I personally worked with several workers (regular employees) who had been with the company well over 25 years. I call that making a living. A company that is world wide has a responsibility to each individual economy it resides in.
The fact that there is an Mcdonalds on every other corner in my old neighborhood screams exploitation to me as wages are flat as ever and the price of everything continues to rise at alarming rates.
Do they deserve 15 per hour? Hell I dont know but I will tell you I'm not doing that shit ever again unless it does go up. Jobs dont pay what they are worth they pay what you are willing to take. I was under paid as a store manager only because it was my first go around. The company was sued by former employees and soon raised its wages. Just an example of companies exploiting workers even at the management level. Why would it not take full advantage of basic associates. Until associates are organized and able to decipher what is fair in today's society they will continue to be exploited by corporations like Mcdonalds, regardless of what you think they deserve.
konceptjones;6133715 said:
The Mcdonalds I worked at had a full week of workbook and video training then a full week of hands on.
I had just graduated from school with a Bachelor of Science, double major and double minor maintaing a 3.0 GPA while playing football and running track and could not wrap Mcgriddles fast enough and distinguish the multiple ways to wrap a damn sandwich when it had cheese or other various items not to mention the drastic transition from breakfast to lunch. Nigga that shit was hard as fuck. You computer niggaz and yall fucking HTML and program writting aint the smartest niggaz out here yall just learn like robots. It aint hard writing programs and building websites my dude that shit come with instructions and no time limits.
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konceptjones
New member
perspective@100;6170222 said:konceptjones;6126259 said:UPTOWNCONNEXX;6117541 said:
bruh... Fast food has NEVER been a full time job.
EVER
Unless you're in management, you don't get 40 hours. It was like that when I did it in high school, it was like that in the 70's, it was like that in the 60's. There's always been that understanding that the shit ain't a 40hr/week job.
They're not "slashing hours", they weren't getting the hours in the first place!
You taking this shit awfully personal Uptown... Perhaps you're working in fast food?
Ole "Can I get a number 5 with cheese" nigga, "Drop fries and pies" ass nigga.
Don't let me call Chanita on yo ass.
So I been reading through this thread... You seem pretty smart but you are wrong on quite a few levels. First, I'm speaking from experience of working at Mcdonalds for 3 months after graduating from college. The managers know the rules on giving hours but they bend them to their benefit. A hard worker such as myself at regular employee status sometimes received a 40 hour work weeks by accident and pure need for my services. Second you categorize a corporations ability to create a business off of what you call entry level jobs. That's not how it works. Once you join the team you are given the opportunity to progress up the ladder. Therefore, a person can and should assume that they will have the ability to make a living off getting a job at a fast food chain. The job was actually modeled on assembly line operations for efficiency. Unfortunately, they did not take the pay rate model.
No, this is simply not the case, not everyone can or will advance. Those that wish to, when they get to that point of "team lead", will get that 40 hrs. From there it's assistant manager then manager. But, this only applies for those that even care to make a career out of it, something which the majority of people working there has no interest in.
Since you used the assembly line analogy, I'll take it a step further: The vast majority of assembly workers, especially in the US auto industry, never advance. They get seniority, but most do not advance off of the assembly floor. My family is deep in the UAW being from a heavy GM town (Saginaw, MI). Most of my family, from my grandfathers, father, grandmother, aunts uncles, and even my stepmother and step brother have all worked at the plants. I know so many people that worked for GM, Ford, and Chrysler that I can safely say that many who start on the line, retire on the line.
I've said repeatedly that minimum should be raised to $9.50/hr.
Let's be real though. I graduated high school in 1990 at a time when minimum wage was $3.80/hr (the following year it was raised to $4.25/hr). Gas was $.89-.99 a gallon, and a combo at McDonalds was $3.
If we follow inflation, $1 back then has the same buying power as $1.79 in 2013, but this is not always the case (i.e. artificially inflated prices on gasoline). That same $3 Big Mac combo from 1990 is now ~$5.69, a few cents more than where it should be ($~5.39). Most thing have gone up along the same line as inflation, meaning that our current minimum of $7.25 technically has exceeded the rate of inflation but not when you factor in artificially inflated prices of things like gas. If gas was where it was supposed to be ($1.79), then our current minimum would have more buying power than what the minimum wage had when I graduated did.
That said, I believe $9.50/hr should be enough for a minimum wage.
Bruh, I worked at a McDonalds when I was 20. The spot was/is located just north of Detroit at about 13 Mile a block or two east of Woodward. It took me all of 30 minutes of training videos and I was behind the grill. This was coming off of almost 3 years as a car audio salesman and custom installer. I did the shit in high school as well at a Hardees off Woodward south of 9 mile for my first job ever (16 years old). Same thing: 15-30 minutes worth of videos and I was behind the grill. The shit really ain't hard at all once you do it a few times.
Who writes programs and builds websites??? Certainly you're not talking about me 'cause that ain't what I do.
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