Why I raise my children without God.

[zombie]

Some would say so because i would love to punch you in the fucking face, it's wrong and i know it's wrong but my faith is not strong enough to keep me from wanting that. i fail to live up to what i should be may god forgive me.

You should have known it was also wrong to curse and call me outside my name given that you have a book that instructs you to love your enemies yet you continued the act of typing out your frustration to insult me. Not only did you do it, but you thought it out since typing coherent sentences requires thought and concentration.

I did say it was wrong you know i don't always obey.

both.

It can't be both. You said it is not the belief in god that causes godly behavior (period). Before that, you said the belief in god changes everything. Everything was meant to include behavior since you were arguing that nonbelief causes moral chaos. Higher morality is cultivated by compassion and understanding towards others, which can be expressed with or without belief in god. Belief in god can only cause lower morality, which is morality expressed through obligation and fear of punishment.

I was right, it is not the belief in god that causes godly behavior i told you it's the faith that does. when i said belief in god changes everything i was talking about human perception of reality of what is right and wrong, it's a mind change, belief is a mind change. Faith is belief put in action which can bring about real change IN OTHER WORDS FAITH changes behavior not belief.

In reality it's not non-belief that causes moral chaos it's non-faith. you can believe in god and still do evil cause you lack faith, but if you have no belief then you can have no faith so there is no hope.

 

[Bodhi]

But since atheist are always attacking God, especially the God of Abraham which include Jews, Christians, Muslims, you guys are in the minority, and it's not even close in the slightest bit. Most people are with our beliefs, so we don't have to prove anything, its really on you guys to bring the definitive proof that God doesn't exist.

What I'm saying is just because the majority believes in something does not make it true. At one point, most of the world believed the earth was flat. Was that true?

If you were in a room of 30 people and a bottle of liquid labeled "poison", 27 people in the room believed the bottle did not contain poison and were actively drinking it, would you drink the liquid on the basis that majority rules or would your decision to drink or not drink require proof beforehand?

 

[zombie]

White Europe is in decline, you don't know this? IN FACT white people world wide are on a population decline.

We're talking about Sweden, Norway, and Denmark, which have all been seeing population increases. Abortion was legalized in all three in the 60s and 70s and the populations have been increasing since then.

Also, given the state of the economy and individual situations, it would be more intelligent not to have children if you can't afford it rather than have children in a situation where you are unable to properly care for them. In addition to that, abortion is not the sole nor leading cause of population decline in either of the countries listed. In fact, Western Europe has one of the lowest abortion rates in the world.

These nations have been seeing population increases in the non-white people living there there the population increase is due to non-whites moving in it's happening all over europe.
http://yaledailynews.com/blog/2008/02/27/white-europeans-an-endangered-species/

The native people in those nations can afford to have more children and chose not to. Abortion is just a symptom of the entire sickness that the west is under WHICH is the non-spitural way of seeing reality reducing all things to matter and only matter and seeking pleasures of the flesh above anything else.

 

[Bodhi]

These nations have been seeing population increases in the non-white people living there there the population increase is due to non-whites moving in it's happening all over europe.
http://yaledailynews.com/blog/2008/02/27/white-europeans-an-endangered-species/

The native people in those nations can afford to have more children and chose not to. Abortion is just a symptom of the entire sickness that the west is under WHICH is the non-spitural way of seeing reality reducing all things to matter and only matter and seeking pleasures of the flesh above anything else.

There are other ways to avoid having children other than abortion, you know. Like I said, Western Europe has one of the lowest abortion rates in the world.

Jamaica's fertility rates still falling
http://www.jamaicaobserver.com/news/Jamaica-s-fertility-rates-still-falling--mdash--UNFPA_13075354

There are also no figures to capture abortions performed in Jamaica, but the Board counts among its successes a fertility rate that continues to decline. The Registrar General's Department registered 41,956 births in 2009, and 42,346 the previous year.

"Jamaica's fertility rates have been declining since the 1970s. The total fertility rate of 2.4 children per woman in Jamaica for 2006-2008 is the lowest ever documented in the country. The median age at first birth was 21.2 years, slightly older than 20.7 years documented in 2002," said executive director of the Board Dr Sharlene Jarrett.

 

[zombie]

White Europe is in decline, you don't know this? IN FACT white people world wide are on a population decline.

We're talking about Sweden, Norway, and Denmark, which have all been seeing population increases. Abortion was legalized in all three in the 60s and 70s and the populations have been increasing since then.

Also, given the state of the economy and individual situations, it would be more intelligent not to have children if you can't afford it rather than have children in a situation where you are unable to properly care for them. In addition to that, abortion is not the sole nor leading cause of population decline in either of the countries listed. In fact, Western Europe has one of the lowest abortion rates in the world.

Jamaica's fertility rates still falling
http://www.jamaicaobserver.com/news/Jamaica-s-fertility-rates-still-falling--mdash--UNFPA_13075354

There are also no figures to capture abortions performed in Jamaica, but the Board counts among its successes a fertility rate that continues to decline. The Registrar General's Department registered 41,956 births in 2009, and 42,346 the previous year.

"Jamaica's fertility rates have been declining since the 1970s. The total fertility rate of 2.4 children per woman in Jamaica for 2006-2008 is the lowest ever documented in the country. The median age at first birth was 21.2 years, slightly older than 20.7 years documented in 2002," said executive director of the Board Dr Sharlene Jarrett.

Dumb ass if the population growth of jamaica is 2.4 and the median age of first birth is 21 then the black population of jamaicans are in no danger of getting old and dying out, however in europe the median age of first birth is much older. Jamaica is a developing nation people are born and the state does not find out until much later. i did not have a birth certificate until i was four and by then i had siblings already.

 

[Bodhi]

when i said belief in god changes everything i was talking about human perception of reality of what is right and wrong

Does God determine what is right and wrong or does right and wrong exist independently of his will?

Faith is belief put in action which can bring about real change IN OTHER WORDS FAITH changes behavior not belief.

Belief is acceptance of something/one existing. Faith is confidence in something/one. The faith is not placed in god's existence alone but in his moral code. And if God is naturally all good, then the moral code is inseperable from God himself so to believe in god is to believe in the moral code of god. Faith, meaning confidence, is a stronger acceptance, or belief, in god.

However, morality is independent of god's existence so non believers can put faith in a system of morality seperable from any god or gods that is beneficial to all involved.

In reality it's not non-belief that causes moral chaos it's non-faith.

Yeah, non faith in morality; not non faith in god.

 

[Bodhi]

Dumb ass if the population growth of jamaica is 2.4 and the median age of first birth is 21 then the black population of jamaicans are in no danger of getting old and dying out.

^^^ Red herring. Jamaica's fertility rates are declining and they have been since the 70's according to Jamaica. And abortion is a factor.

 

[zombie]

when i said belief in god changes everything i was talking about human perception of reality of what is right and wrong

Does God determine what is right and wrong or does right and wrong exist independently of his will?

Faith is belief put in action which can bring about real change IN OTHER WORDS FAITH changes behavior not belief.

Belief is acceptance of something/one existing. Faith is confidence in something/one. The faith is not placed in god's existence alone but the truth of his moral code. And if God is naturally all good, then the moral code is inseperable from God himself so to believe in god is to believe in the moral code of god.

However, morality is independent of god's existence so non believers can put faith in a system of morality that is beneficial to all involved.

In reality it's not non-belief that causes moral chaos it's non-faith.

Yeah, non faith in morality; not non faith in god.

God is the sum and essence of morality he determines what is right, what is wrong is anything that choses not to obey his moral will. his will is to give us choice this will is different from his moral will. god's moral will is the way he wants us to live. But god's will in another context is the power given to man to chose to obey god's moral will or not. In other words it is gods will that man has the power to chose to obey or not god's moral will. DON'T drag ME INTO THE WHOLE FREEWILL ARGUMENT I'VE BEEN THERE WITH YOU AND IT LEADS NOWHERE.

Faith without works is dead meaning faith only exist when it is enforced, it is action not just confidence. you can believe in god's moral code and god but if you don't practice it you don't have any faith. your faith is in man my faith is in god.

 

[Lot86]

What I'm saying is just because the majority believes in something does not make it true. At one point, most of the world believed the earth was flat. Was that true?

If you were in a room of 30 people and a bottle of liquid labeled "poison", 27 people in the room believed the bottle did not contain poison and were actively drinking it, would you drink the liquid on the basis that majority rules or would your decision to drink or not drink require proof beforehand?

My fault, you responded to a post which was a response to a post about us having to be the ones to bring the definitive proof. The earth flat subject, in everyone's eyes, it looked flat, no matter where you went, it was always flat. We got the proof eventually about the earth being round. Until we get the definitive proof of the non-existence of a god, I can't say your wrong, you can't say I'm wrong.

 

[zombie]

Dumb ass if the population growth of jamaica is 2.4 and the median age of first birth is 21 then the black population of jamaicans are in no danger of getting old and dying out.

^^^ Red herring. Jamaica's fertility rates are declining and they have been since the 70's according to Jamaica. And abortion is a factor.

This is the jamaican government we are talking about here, the data is faulty. and even if true the affects of it would not be as society destroying as if would be in europe because jamaica would not be swamped with non black immigrants.

 

[Bodhi]

God is the sum and essence of morality he determines what is right, what is wrong is anything that choses not to obey his moral will..

What if, tomorrow, God had a change of heart and decided to do evil. Would you follow him??

DON'T drag ME INTO THE WHOLE FREEWILL ARGUMENT I'VE BEEN THERE WITH YOU AND IT LEADS NOWHERE.

If creation is anything, it is the physical manifestation of God's will, so the fact that evil exists would mean that God willed it into existence and if God is the creator of everything, he is also the creator of the will of man. Man's will could only be secondhand to God's ultimate will.

If you don't want to discuss it, drop it.

your faith is in man the practice; my faith is in god.

My faith in the practice has resulted in my kindness and peacefulness towards you, even though you continue to be disrespectful.

Your faith in god has resulted in the intention to degrade those who disagree with you.

 

[Bodhi]

the data is faulty.

Sure.

and even if true the affects of it would not be as society destroying as if would be in europe because jamaica would not be swamped with non black immigrants.

I don't see the connection here between non black immigrants coming into a jamaica that has a declining fertility rate. If anything, that would mean that non black immigrants could, in the future, outnumber jamaican natives if the fertility rate continues to decline.

But whatever though. The point is Jamaica's fertility rate is declining and abortion is a problem. Get over it.

 

[zombie]

God is the sum and essence of morality he determines what is right, what is wrong is anything that choses not to obey his moral will..

What if, tomorrow, God had a change of heart and decided to do evil. Would you follow him??

DON'T drag ME INTO THE WHOLE FREEWILL ARGUMENT I'VE BEEN THERE WITH YOU AND IT LEADS NOWHERE.

If creation is anything, it is the physical manifestation of God's will, so the fact that evil exists would mean that God willed it into existence and if God is the creator of everything, he is also the creator of the will of man. Man's will could only be secondhand to God's ultimate will.

If you don't want to discuss it, drop it.

I told you i was not getting into the freewill argument with you so why the fuck are you asking me this

your faith is in man the practice; my faith is in god.

My faith in the practice has resulted in my kindness and peacefulness towards you, even though you continue to be disrespectful.

Your faith in god has resulted in the intention to degrade those who disagree with you.

Fuck being nice, my understanding outstrips my patience. theist are under constant attack god is disrespected constantly and believers do nothing or say nothing i get sick of it sometimes. of course you can only disrespect god in a christian nation anywhere else and you would be dead.

 

[zombie]

God is the sum and essence of morality he determines what is right, what is wrong is anything that choses not to obey his moral will..

What if, tomorrow, God had a change of heart and decided to do evil. Would you follow him??

DON'T drag ME INTO THE WHOLE FREEWILL ARGUMENT I'VE BEEN THERE WITH YOU AND IT LEADS NOWHERE.

If creation is anything, it is the physical manifestation of God's will, so the fact that evil exists would mean that God willed it into existence and if God is the creator of everything, he is also the creator of the will of man. Man's will could only be secondhand to God's ultimate will.

If you don't want to discuss it, drop it.

your faith is in man the practice; my faith is in god.

My faith in the practice has resulted in my kindness and peacefulness towards you, even though you continue to be disrespectful.

Your faith in god has resulted in the intention to degrade those who disagree with you.

.

 

[zombie]

the data is faulty.

Sure.

and even if true the affects of it would not be as society destroying as if would be in europe because jamaica would not be swamped with non black immigrants.

I don't see the connection here between non black immigrants coming into a jamaica that has a declining fertility rate. If anything, that would mean that non black immigrants could, in the future, outnumber jamaican natives if the fertility rate continues to decline.

But whatever though. The point is Jamaica's fertility rate is declining and abortion is a problem. Get over it.

There is no mass non-black immigration to jamaica that is the difference. IN EUROPE there is a mass immigrations of non-white people who are more than not religious, thus in future they will fundamentaly change the nature of those nations. They will destroy what once was. IT IS only the native people who are die hard atheist and it is only the native people who have lots of abortions and that is the whole point. abortions in jamaica is not going to have the same social effects as it will in europe white people will die and their atheism will die with them.

.

Even if JAMAICA has a declining fertility rate we have a younger population so if i have my first son at 21 by 31 i could have had another 3.

 

[Bodhi]

IT IS only the native people who are die hard atheist and it is only the native people who have lots of abortions and that is the whole point. abortions in jamaica is not going to have the same social effects as it will in europe white people will die and their atheism will die with them.

.

Again, western Europe has one of the lowest abortion rates in the world.

Even if JAMAICA has a declining fertility rate we have a younger population

Your younger population is continuing to abort its children, resulting in a steadier declining number of births.

so if i have my first son at 21 by 31 i could have had another 3.

Looking at the extremely high unemployment rate of Jamaica, you might not have a job to support that many kids by then. Terrible economy + increase of populace = bad situation for the society. But since abortion is so strong in Jamaica, the fertility rate has been decreasing for several decades now, regardless of adherance to theistic beliefs.

 

[Bodhi]

What I'm saying is just because the majority believes in something does not make it true. At one point, most of the world believed the earth was flat. Was that true?

If you were in a room of 30 people and a bottle of liquid labeled "poison", 27 people in the room believed the bottle did not contain poison and were actively drinking it, would you drink the liquid on the basis that majority rules or would your decision to drink or not drink require proof beforehand?

My fault, you responded to a post which was a response to a post about us having to be the ones to bring the definitive proof. The earth flat subject, in everyone's eyes, it looked flat, no matter where you went, it was always flat. We got the proof eventually about the earth being round. Until we get the definitive proof of the non-existence of a god, I can't say your wrong, you can't say I'm wrong.

The only thing is we have the proof required in order to disprove the Abrahamic god. The proof lies in the incoherent and illogical descriptions of that god. Therefore the ball is back in the theists court to address these logical fallacies and inconsistencies and offer the proof needed to save the theistic argument.

 

[Bodhi]

And @Lot86, you did not answer my question about the bottle of poison.

 

[zombie]

IT IS only the native people who are die hard atheist and it is only the native people who have lots of abortions and that is the whole point. abortions in jamaica is not going to have the same social effects as it will in europe white people will die and their atheism will die with them.

.

Again, western Europe has one of the lowest abortion rates in the world.

Even if JAMAICA has a declining fertility rate we have a younger population

Your younger population is continuing to abort its children, resulting in a steadier declining number of births.

so if i have my first son at 21 by 31 i could have had another 3.

Looking at the extremely high unemployment rate of Jamaica, you might not have a job to support that many kids by then. Terrible economy + increase of populace = bad situation for the society. But since abortion is so strong in Jamaica, the fertility rate has been decreasing for several decades now, regardless of adherance to theistic beliefs.

Western europe has a low birth rate so any abortion among the native people in stupid, because it increases the destructive power of that abortion. It is better for a people to be poor and be alive than it is for a people to be dead. You can ignore this if you want to but the fact still remains that abortions have a greater effect on europe than it does on jamaica. The real birth rate of jamaicans is unknown the first 4 years of my life is a testament to that.

jamaica is poor poverty is the reason for the abortions, western europe is rich the reasons for their low birth rate is cultural changes of which atheism is one. what is your source for western europe having the lowest abortion rate.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/a...early-pregnancies-Europe-end-termination.html

if we did not hold to theistic beliefs then our population would be in worse shape than it is now. Europeans and atheism are a dying forces. white people have foolishly embraces that nonsense and will lose influence in the world because of it.

 

[Bodhi]

Fuck being nice

Says the person that claims belief in god gives one the knowledge to know what is right and wrong. Instead of being here, you should be praying for strengthening of your faith so that you can act in a more civilized and righteouss way