Better rapper Vol. 32: Ghostface or Jay-Z

[And_So_It_Burns]

I feel like Reasonable Doubt is better lyrically than any project Ghost has ever done. Jay is simply the better rapper. Not solely because of RD. I don't think Ghost could ever go at an emcee the way Jay did with takeover and bp2. Not to mention the countless features he's merked. He has regressed lately if this was asking about the last 5 years or so Ghost would take this easily.

Storytelling: GHost

Lyrically: Jay

Delivery: Ghost

Flow/Rhyme structure: Jay

Catalog: Jay...even tho the gap has been closing

Jay is more of top 3 while ghost is more top 10.

Both of them are two of the greatest to ever do it. Ghost doesn't get enough mentions in GOAT debates tho

 

[Kwan Dai]

I feel like Reasonable Doubt is better lyrically than any project Ghost has ever done. Jay is simply the better rapper. Not solely because of RD. I don't think Ghost could ever go at an emcee the way Jay did with takeover and bp2. Not to mention the countless features he's merked. He has regressed lately if this was asking about the last 5 years or so Ghost would take this easily.

Storytelling: GHost

Lyrically: Jay

Delivery: Ghost

Flow/Rhyme structure: Jay

Catalog: Jay...even tho the gap has been closing

Jay is more of top 3 while ghost is more top 10.

Both of them are two of the greatest to ever do it. Ghost doesn't get enough mentions in GOAT debates tho

Take over ended up with Jay getting his ass handed to him, retiring then taking pot shots at MC's from a wheel chair. Chill with the overrating. And that's the issue with Jay listeners. Yall always find a way to go way overboard. Yall confuse his popularity, and bank account with real MCing.

 

[GetoBoy]

Why does it always have to be hate? I voted for jay but anyone who said ghost can make a good argument. One of the most slept on of all time

The same reason why if you support somebody then you're a stan/warrior caping for em....apparently there's no grey area around this parts...

 

[jono]

Let's go Lp for LP based on critic ratings. On meta critic.com which compiles music critic ratings for each LP . Jay gotem. Then I can shut this thread down.

lol This has to be the stupidest suggestion for settling this debate ever, but...

Jay-Z

MCHG: Critic - 59 User -5.7

BP3: Critic - 65 User - 7.2

AG: Critic - 83 User - 8.4

KC: Critic - 67 User6.9

BA: Critic - 84 User - 8.7

BP2: Critic - 64 User - 7.7

BP: Critic - 64 User - 8.8

Avg - Critic - 73 User - 7.6

Ghostface

12RtD: Critic - 78 User - 7.8

AK: Critic - 84 User - 8

G:WoP: Critic - 68 User - 8.4

BDR: Critic - 77 User - 8.3

MF: Critic - 77 User - 8.9

FS: Critic - 88 User - 8.8

PT: Critic - 84 User - 8

Avg: Critic 77 User - 8.3

So uhhhh does this mean Ghostface wins by a mile?

Several albums missing from this list thus it's invalid.

 

[Kalecrunch]

Let's go Lp for LP based on critic ratings. On meta critic.com which compiles music critic ratings for each LP . Jay gotem. Then I can shut this thread down.

lol This has to be the stupidest suggestion for settling this debate ever, but...

Jay-Z

MCHG: Critic - 59 User -5.7

BP3: Critic - 65 User - 7.2

AG: Critic - 83 User - 8.4

KC: Critic - 67 User6.9

BA: Critic - 84 User - 8.7

BP2: Critic - 64 User - 7.7

BP: Critic - 64 User - 8.8

Avg - Critic - 73 User - 7.6

Ghostface

12RtD: Critic - 78 User - 7.8

AK: Critic - 84 User - 8

G:WoP: Critic - 68 User - 8.4

BDR: Critic - 77 User - 8.3

MF: Critic - 77 User - 8.9

FS: Critic - 88 User - 8.8

PT: Critic - 84 User - 8

Avg: Critic 77 User - 8.3

So uhhhh does this mean Ghostface wins by a mile?

How but including Jay's Most Important work. You know like Reasonable Doubt. Dynasty LP (crowned by the IC as best intro song in Rap ever. In My Lifetime volumes . Don't leave out that.

 

[ericb4prez]

you

This nigga said Ghostface got the better wordplay, I'm out.

But.... I'll leave this here, first.

Have you even listened to Ghost's catalog? You're a known Warrior.

I'm not a known "warrior", you're a known idiot, though.

And I've heard Ghost's shit.

Its a difference between the spitters and niggas like Jay.

Jay rarely gets off into that zone like he did in roc boyz but he's capable of it.

Ghost got whole albums where he's just going In.

Ghost put in a lot of work, we can go track for track and Im sure when Jay runs out of shit we will still be posting ghost tracks.

All that diamond, versace shit he was doing in the late 90s dont even compare to what Ghost was doing lyrically in that same period of time.

Jay is a better entrepreneur and that is all.

What are you talking about?

Jay dropped RD, Vol.1-3 during the late 90's, lmfao@ That not comparing.


Damn, you fadin em', Hov.

A bruh.

Ob4cl

Iron man

wu-tang forever

and Supreme Clientele

Vs

RD

Vol 1-3

Explain...this should be interesting

Supreme Clientele came out in 2000, bruh.

WU-Tang Forever is a group project, bruh.

Iron Man and OB4CL are dope though.

And why the fuck are you talking about projects, when we're talking about pure rapping.

And finally, Jay was going bar for bar with BIG, but he wouldn't have been able to go bar for bar with Ghost? Are you niggas serious? Lmao.

you niggaz cape so hard you dont even make sense

Tell me the errors in my logic.

U said forever is a group project but so is ironman ob4cl and in terms of holdin his own wit big I feel meth did a better job on the what

 

[The Lonious Monk]

Let's go Lp for LP based on critic ratings. On meta critic.com which compiles music critic ratings for each LP . Jay gotem. Then I can shut this thread down.

lol This has to be the stupidest suggestion for settling this debate ever, but...

Jay-Z

MCHG: Critic - 59 User -5.7

BP3: Critic - 65 User - 7.2

AG: Critic - 83 User - 8.4

KC: Critic - 67 User6.9

BA: Critic - 84 User - 8.7

BP2: Critic - 64 User - 7.7

BP: Critic - 64 User - 8.8

Avg - Critic - 73 User - 7.6

Ghostface

12RtD: Critic - 78 User - 7.8

AK: Critic - 84 User - 8

G:WoP: Critic - 68 User - 8.4

BDR: Critic - 77 User - 8.3

MF: Critic - 77 User - 8.9

FS: Critic - 88 User - 8.8

PT: Critic - 84 User - 8

Avg: Critic 77 User - 8.3

So uhhhh does this mean Ghostface wins by a mile?

How but including Jay's Most Important work. You know like Reasonable Doubt. Dynasty LP (crowned by the IC as best intro song in Rap ever. In My Lifetime volumes . Don't leave out that.

Hey those are the only albums metacritic had? I just took your suggestion and threw it back at you. Besides, you dudes are failing to acknowledge that Ghostface has albums missing too: Ironman, Supreme Clientele, and Bulletproof Wallets. In other words, his two best albums and one of his better albums aren't on the list. And if we are going to include the Dynasty LP which was a group album, you'd have to throw in the Wu-tang albums too. So no matter how you look at it, Ghostface comes out on top.

 

[MR Josh]

Honestly? I don't rank him at all. He's not even on my radar. The ONLY song I like that he recorded is, the D'evils. I've never been impressed by him as an MC. He's average to me like say Snoop. They made huge hits in their day and they still make moves in the current market.

As a commercially viable artist and businessman he is by all means one of Raps biggest artist ever. Props to him.

However, my Hip Hop sensibilities\experience\knowledge\participation will not let me factor that into assessing an MC's skills and for me Jayz has never cut it.

I respect your opinion but in my own opinion what you wrote is complete nonsense.you might not like jay,he might not be in your top 50 but what you cannot do with "your hiphop sense,experience and knowledge" is to discredit his skills an MC.....

 

[Kwan Dai]

Honestly? I don't rank him at all. He's not even on my radar. The ONLY song I like that he recorded is, the D'evils. I've never been impressed by him as an MC. He's average to me like say Snoop. They made huge hits in their day and they still make moves in the current market.

As a commercially viable artist and businessman he is by all means one of Raps biggest artist ever. Props to him.

However, my Hip Hop sensibilities\experience\knowledge\participation will not let me factor that into assessing an MC's skills and for me Jayz has never cut it.

I respect your opinion but in my own opinion what you wrote is complete nonsense.you might not like jay,he might not be in your top 50 but what you cannot do with "your hiphop sense,experience and knowledge" is to discredit his skills an MC.....

Word? You realize "but" nullifies any statements made before it. So you really don't respect my opinion. You didn't have to quote me to profess your love and admiration for all things Jayz. Step off. Post your feelings without involving me.

 

[NothingButTheTruth]

I respect your opinion but in my own opinion what you wrote is complete nonsense.you might not like jay,he might not be in your top 50 but what you cannot do with "your hiphop sense,experience and knowledge" is to discredit his skills an MC.....

Any objective JayZ fan or fan of music period, can tell that JayZ has fell way the fuck off. His skills are no longer there. He's not even close to the same JayZ.

JayZ has been wack for a minute now ... and because he continues to release music, his legacy as far as skill, catalog etc. will only get worse.

He's had 4 solo albums since retirement, and only 1 of them was up to par with his older shit. He went from averaging 30ppg to putting up 12ppg, so it's only right that his rank goes down since his output continues to diminish.

 

[A$AP_A$TON]

I would try and state a case why jay is better but seeing as how this is the IC aka the capital of jay z hate it wouldn't make a difference so I'm not even gonna try and waste my time

*Kanye shrug*

Why does it always have to be hate? I voted for jay but anyone who said ghost can make a good argument. One of the most slept on of all time

Ghost is dope but he's not even better than Method Man.

FOH you can't be serious

I'm serious as fuck. Most the time Ghost verse aren't even coherent. It's just he got a dope delivery. Ghost is prolly the second or 3rd dopest in Wu behind Rae, depending on your preference.

 

[THIRDSUPREME]

Let's go Lp for LP based on critic ratings. On meta critic.com which compiles music critic ratings for each LP . Jay gotem. Then I can shut this thread down.

lol This has to be the stupidest suggestion for settling this debate ever, but...

Jay-Z

MCHG: Critic - 59 User -5.7

BP3: Critic - 65 User - 7.2

AG: Critic - 83 User - 8.4

KC: Critic - 67 User6.9

BA: Critic - 84 User - 8.7

BP2: Critic - 64 User - 7.7

BP: Critic - 64 User - 8.8

Avg - Critic - 73 User - 7.6

Ghostface

12RtD: Critic - 78 User - 7.8

AK: Critic - 84 User - 8

G:WoP: Critic - 68 User - 8.4

BDR: Critic - 77 User - 8.3

MF: Critic - 77 User - 8.9

FS: Critic - 88 User - 8.8

PT: Critic - 84 User - 8

Avg: Critic 77 User - 8.3

So uhhhh does this mean Ghostface wins by a mile?

How but including Jay's Most Important work. You know like Reasonable Doubt. Dynasty LP (crowned by the IC as best intro song in Rap ever. In My Lifetime volumes . Don't leave out that.

He did the last 7 albums.

Now as I said before if you want to compare everything ghost did with wu-tang, cuban lynx, iron man, Suopreme Clientelle

vs

RD and vol 1-3 you're just shooting yourself in the foot.

 

[The Lonious Monk]

I would try and state a case why jay is better but seeing as how this is the IC aka the capital of jay z hate it wouldn't make a difference so I'm not even gonna try and waste my time

*Kanye shrug*

Why does it always have to be hate? I voted for jay but anyone who said ghost can make a good argument. One of the most slept on of all time

Ghost is dope but he's not even better than Method Man.

FOH you can't be serious

I'm serious as fuck. Most the time Ghost verse aren't even coherent. It's just he got a dope delivery. Ghost is prolly the second or 3rd dopest in Wu behind Rae, depending on your preference.

So you don't understand his verse in Can It Be or Impossible or Cherchez La Ghost? The cats saying that Ghost's verses aren't coherent all the time are either stupid or don't listen to Ghost like that. It's cool if you ain't really up on him, but stop saying this dumb shit if you don't know what you're talking about. Yeah, in the past some of Ghost's lyrics have been unintelligible. He's admitted that himself, but even at his worse, that was only an every once in a while thing. And he hasn't even done that for like a decade, so quite spouting this nonsense.

 

[A$AP_A$TON]

I would try and state a case why jay is better but seeing as how this is the IC aka the capital of jay z hate it wouldn't make a difference so I'm not even gonna try and waste my time

*Kanye shrug*

Why does it always have to be hate? I voted for jay but anyone who said ghost can make a good argument. One of the most slept on of all time

Ghost is dope but he's not even better than Method Man.

FOH you can't be serious

I'm serious as fuck. Most the time Ghost verse aren't even coherent. It's just he got a dope delivery. Ghost is prolly the second or 3rd dopest in Wu behind Rae, depending on your preference.

So you don't understand his verse in Can It Be or Impossible or Cherchez La Ghost? The cats saying that Ghost's verses aren't coherent all the time are either stupid or don't listen to Ghost like that. It's cool if you ain't really up on him, but stop saying this dumb shit if you don't know what you're talking about. Yeah, in the past some of Ghost's lyrics have been unintelligible. He's admitted that himself, but even at his worse, that was only an every once in a while thing. And he hasn't even done that for like a decade, so quite spouting this nonsense.

Lol. Every once in a while. Yea ok.

 

[Tommy bilfiger]

I'm high powered/I 'd put adina howard to sleep/Yo pardon that bitch been on my mind all week/But uh bacc to you maybeline queen let's make a team/You can have anything in this world except C.r.e.a.m

Lol @ ghost having no quotable bars

 

[ericb4prez]

Niggaz talkin bout he incoherent at times but so is Rae and I bet y'all would pick him over ghost if that was the poll

 

[The Lonious Monk]

I would try and state a case why jay is better but seeing as how this is the IC aka the capital of jay z hate it wouldn't make a difference so I'm not even gonna try and waste my time

*Kanye shrug*

Why does it always have to be hate? I voted for jay but anyone who said ghost can make a good argument. One of the most slept on of all time

Ghost is dope but he's not even better than Method Man.

FOH you can't be serious

I'm serious as fuck. Most the time Ghost verse aren't even coherent. It's just he got a dope delivery. Ghost is prolly the second or 3rd dopest in Wu behind Rae, depending on your preference.

So you don't understand his verse in Can It Be or Impossible or Cherchez La Ghost? The cats saying that Ghost's verses aren't coherent all the time are either stupid or don't listen to Ghost like that. It's cool if you ain't really up on him, but stop saying this dumb shit if you don't know what you're talking about. Yeah, in the past some of Ghost's lyrics have been unintelligible. He's admitted that himself, but even at his worse, that was only an every once in a while thing. And he hasn't even done that for like a decade, so quite spouting this nonsense.

Lol. Every once in a while. Yea ok.

Post some of his incoherent lyrics then since he has so many.

 

[MrSoutCity]

Ghosts wins because I can listen to anything he puts out. Jay z not so much.

 

[Kalecrunch]

Jay Z Reasonable Doubt Critical Acclaim .

Professional ratings

Review scores

Allmusic [26] ***** 5 stars

Billboard favorable [27]

Robert Christgau A− [28]

CMJ favorable [29]

Entertainment Weekly B+ [30]

IGN 7.8/10 [31]

Los Angeles Daily News 3out of 4 stars

Rolling Stone 5 stars

The Source 5 mics

XXL (XXL) [35]

The album was well received by music critics upon its release.

Let's go Lp for LP based on critic ratings. On meta critic.com which compiles music critic ratings for each LP . Jay gotem. Then I can shut this thread down.

lol This has to be the stupidest suggestion for settling this debate ever, but...

Jay-Z

MCHG: Critic - 59 User -5.7

BP3: Critic - 65 User - 7.2

AG: Critic - 83 User - 8.4

KC: Critic - 67 User6.9

BA: Critic - 84 User - 8.7

BP2: Critic - 64 User - 7.7

BP: Critic - 64 User - 8.8

Avg - Critic - 73 User - 7.6

Ghostface

12RtD: Critic - 78 User - 7.8

AK: Critic - 84 User - 8

G:WoP: Critic - 68 User - 8.4

BDR: Critic - 77 User - 8.3

MF: Critic - 77 User - 8.9

FS: Critic - 88 User - 8.8

PT: Critic - 84 User - 8

Avg: Critic 77 User - 8.3

So uhhhh does this mean Ghostface wins by a mile?

How but including Jay's Most Important work. You know like Reasonable Doubt. Dynasty LP (crowned by the IC as best intro song in Rap ever. In My Lifetime volumes . Don't leave out that.

Hey those are the only albums metacritic had? I just took your suggestion and threw it back at you. Besides, you dudes are failing to acknowledge that Ghostface has albums missing too: Ironman, Supreme Clientele, and Bulletproof Wallets. In other words, his two best albums and one of his better albums aren't on the list. And if we are going to include the Dynasty LP which was a group album, you'd have to throw in the Wu-tang albums too. So no matter how you look at it, Ghostface comes out on top.

 

[Kalecrunch]

Reasonable Doubt and Blueprint 1 alone overstands Ghost Entire catatolog. Don't get me wrong I Fucksbwith Supreme Clientelle hard. I bought the CD three different times. But RD is a hallmark. Blueprint another pillar in Hip Hop period.