Should Radio Support Local Artists? Hot 97 Explains Why NY Underground Artists Aren't Played

[Kwan Dai]

Those underground types would have to get played on like community stations. Its underground. Far as the big stations, they tryin to get all the money they can the easiest and cheapest way possible. That means play the top most popular hits. If somebody tried to play stuff on that format people arent really tryin to hear, they will get moved to the side and someone they can make money with will be brought in.

Even out here in the Atl area,they play like blocks of 80s-90s rap during like lunch time. Just like a few weeks ago they was playin Special ed, Chubb rock etc. on one of the biggest stations in the South.

I am not following this. You aren't the only person who's typed this. The radio stations are the ones pretty much breaking the records that lead to them being labeled hits. So, if they aren't playing a record it's not going to get that status. A record isn't a hit until it's played on the radio 30 times a day. That's why these artists complain about lack of spins.

I have read and heard many people say they didn't like a song but after listening to it enough times it "grew on them". So, the radio station doesn't know what's going to hit or miss until they play it 30 times a day be it underground, overground or from out of space.

 

[a_list]

I believe that shyt should be given a shot, just see what the response is like.....Shyt flex should give cats a shot....but @ the same time these rappers know what hot 97 plays...maybe they should adjust their sound to that......unless you're an established rapper, you're not going to be able stick to what u do.....simple math party/trap beat, simple lyrics lead to radio play

Good point. But here's the rub. Anyone who says they ride for Hip Hop should never want to back artists into a corner where they are doing what everyone else is doing. Unfortunately that's where we are now.

I understand this but these cats are about ratings...You cant complain if your not on the same page as what these cats are doing....if sean price dumbed down and got on a beat that French Montana raps to and they still didnt try to break the record then he has every right to complain.... just using price as an example...the fans and the popularity of the music has dwindled and there seems to be only 1 popular sound.....remember when the fugees and Pac were able to do 6 mill plus both in the same year, totally different sounds but there was room in the mainstram for both....we know it aint like that no more, so these cats need to get on board if they want that radio support

 

[Meta_Conscious]

seriously, fuck radio... I dont buy albums based on radio spins... who does?

 

[usmarin3]

I don't think you niggas understand the relationship of major labels and radio. Technically payola is illegal but the radio and labels have found a way around it with using a middle man. These labels pay the middle man and give labels their artist for things like Summer Jam, and big concerts.

Radio literally makes all it's money through advertisement and payola. What makes you think they're gonna work with some underground niggas, they have nothing to offer. Why do you think despite selling 100's of thousands you don't hear Mac Miller on the radio, because Mac isn't signed to a major. Kendrick, J Cole, Frank Ocean,etc have major distribution and some pull.

Why do you think majors are trying to sign Macklemore and Mac Miller, even though i think they are smart for staying indy.

 

[Kwan Dai]

The way i look at it is, a radio station shouldn't have to give a artist buzz, a artist buzz has to be organic and then the radio should pick up on that buzz. As far as force feeding some of these boring ass underground artist to the mainstream, if you can't create a natural buzz (like Kendrick, Frank Ocean,etc), then what makes these dudes think radio can help them.

You don't need radio to blow up nowadays, radio is almost dead. You have examples of dudes making it out here without initial hits (Kendrick, J Cole, Mackelmore,Mac Miller, Frank Ocean) and selling 100's of thousands of records.

Radio stations shouldn't but they do. Back in the day artists would makes their rounds. There was a thread where Wu-tang was getting clowned for going to Texas for a show and being paid pennies. But that's how you built your buzz by actually rocking the crowd and being on the road. Now these cats sit behind a computer and think it's grinding. Not to mention it's easy to create a buzz for yourself online by fudging with number of views, downloads etc.

It works both ways though. The radio is force feeding whack ass, boring commercial artists so why not give all an equal shot at breaking a hit record?

I agree you don't need radio to blow but it's still a strong tool to make that happen. The guys you mentioned are either White or connected to some of the most commercially successful artists in Rap. So, I wouldn't think radio would be that big of a deal.

 

[S2J]

Yall nggas dancin around the issue and making this more difficult than it need be.

Go to a club. Listen to the bufoonery they play. Go to the mall- Look at the fuckery that is our youth. Watch 106 n Park...Listen to the 'top 5 at 5' or whatever radio does. Are they givin shut outs to the nggas just gettin off work? Lol no. They givin shout outs to high schools....cmon

THAT is the target market, not 'us'. We as adults have our own mediums for music. Satellite radio, anyone? Ipods? Its the age 14-18 demographic that gets most of their music via radio.

If i was a radio engineer, why in the bloody hell would i play Sean Price!?!?!

 

[Kwan Dai]

I believe that shyt should be given a shot, just see what the response is like.....Shyt flex should give cats a shot....but @ the same time these rappers know what hot 97 plays...maybe they should adjust their sound to that......unless you're an established rapper, you're not going to be able stick to what u do.....simple math party/trap beat, simple lyrics lead to radio play

Good point. But here's the rub. Anyone who says they ride for Hip Hop should never want to back artists into a corner where they are doing what everyone else is doing. Unfortunately that's where we are now.

I understand this but these cats are about ratings...You cant complain if your not on the same page as what these cats are doing....if sean price dumbed down and got on a beat that French Montana raps to and they still didnt try to break the record then he has every right to complain.... just using price as an example...the fans and the popularity of the music has dwindled and there seems to be only 1 popular sound.....remember when the fugees and Pac were able to do 6 mill plus both in the same year, totally different sounds but there was room in the mainstram for both....we know it aint like that no more, so these cats need to get on board if they want that radio support

While your reasoning is sound. This is what makes an artist a sell out. No they shouldn't just get on board and do what 99.9% of the game is doing to make money or get spins. Artists shouldn't complain. However, they should speak out about there being a Monopoly in place that is hurting their ability to maximize their earning potential. No artists should just accept the Blatant bullshit going in Hip Hop right now.

 

[Kwan Dai]

I don't think you niggas understand the relationship of major labels and radio. Technically payola is illegal but the radio and labels have found a way around it with using a middle man. These labels pay the middle man and give labels their artist for things like Summer Jam, and big concerts.

Radio literally makes all it's money through advertisement and payola. What makes you think they're gonna work with some underground niggas, they have nothing to offer. Why do you think despite selling 100's of thousands you don't hear Mac Miller on the radio, because Mac isn't signed to a major. Kendrick, J Cole, Frank Ocean,etc have major distribution and some pull.

Why do you think majors are trying to sign Macklemore and Mac Miller, even though i think they are smart for staying indy.

I think most of us do understand this relationship and thus don't like commercial radio, commercial artists and commercial Hip hop.

 

[usmarin3]

The way i look at it is, a radio station shouldn't have to give a artist buzz, a artist buzz has to be organic and then the radio should pick up on that buzz. As far as force feeding some of these boring ass underground artist to the mainstream, if you can't create a natural buzz (like Kendrick, Frank Ocean,etc), then what makes these dudes think radio can help them.

You don't need radio to blow up nowadays, radio is almost dead. You have examples of dudes making it out here without initial hits (Kendrick, J Cole, Mackelmore,Mac Miller, Frank Ocean) and selling 100's of thousands of records.

Radio stations shouldn't but they do. Back in the day artists would makes their rounds. There was a thread where Wu-tang was getting clowned for going to Texas for a show and being paid pennies. But that's how you built your buzz by actually rocking the crowd and being on the road. Now these cats sit behind a computer and think it's grinding. Not to mention it's easy to create a buzz for yourself online by fudging with number of views, downloads etc.

It works both ways though. The radio is force feeding whack ass, boring commercial artists so why not give all an equal shot at breaking a hit record?

I agree you don't need radio to blow but it's still a strong tool to make that happen. The guys you mentioned are either White or connected to some of the most commercially successful artists in Rap. So, I wouldn't think radio would be that big of a deal.

You can't compare radio now to radio back in the day, the paradigm has changed. Music isn't selling like how it use to and the music business is not the same.

Ya'll give the radio way too much power, NO AMOUNT OF FORCE FEEDING IS EVER GOING TO MAKE SEAN PRICE, CURRENSY, SKYZOO,ETC RELEVANT OR POPULAR. Ya'll over simplify the music business way too much imo, some artist just don't have that ''it factor'' to ever translate on a commercial level. I don't care if you give them a Timbaland beat and a mil promotion budget.

As for boring commercial artist, they clearly aren't boring to the mass public if they are selling millions. Who the fuck is really the boring one if you can't translate to nothing but a niche audience (undergound music fans)?

IMO most of these underground artist lack something. They either have no ''it'' factor or they just aren't good song makers, when i say song makers i mean write catchy hooks, choruses, and pick beats.

You look at the niggas who made it from the underground (Jay, Em, Nas, Big,etc), they all were great writers and knew how to make catchy tunes.

 

[R.D.]

where is this thread going ?

the point was these bitch ass radio people being sheep and not breaking artists....if you wont play my shit 1st, who will ?

 

[usmarin3]

I don't think you niggas understand the relationship of major labels and radio. Technically payola is illegal but the radio and labels have found a way around it with using a middle man. These labels pay the middle man and give labels their artist for things like Summer Jam, and big concerts.

Radio literally makes all it's money through advertisement and payola. What makes you think they're gonna work with some underground niggas, they have nothing to offer. Why do you think despite selling 100's of thousands you don't hear Mac Miller on the radio, because Mac isn't signed to a major. Kendrick, J Cole, Frank Ocean,etc have major distribution and some pull.

Why do you think majors are trying to sign Macklemore and Mac Miller, even though i think they are smart for staying indy.

I think most of us do understand this relationship and thus don't like commercial radio, commercial artists and commercial Hip hop.

Then why the fuck are ya'll crying? lmfao

You don't like commercial music, well fine don't listen to it, but don't get mad when the masses or radio doesn't give a fuck about mc such and such making niche music to a niche audience.

 

[usmarin3]

It's not radio's job to break artist, the paradigm has changed, this ain't the fucking 1990's. There is this thing called the internet and this thing called a ipod. lol

 

[Kwan Dai]

The way i look at it is, a radio station shouldn't have to give a artist buzz, a artist buzz has to be organic and then the radio should pick up on that buzz. As far as force feeding some of these boring ass underground artist to the mainstream, if you can't create a natural buzz (like Kendrick, Frank Ocean,etc), then what makes these dudes think radio can help them.

You don't need radio to blow up nowadays, radio is almost dead. You have examples of dudes making it out here without initial hits (Kendrick, J Cole, Mackelmore,Mac Miller, Frank Ocean) and selling 100's of thousands of records.

Radio stations shouldn't but they do. Back in the day artists would makes their rounds. There was a thread where Wu-tang was getting clowned for going to Texas for a show and being paid pennies. But that's how you built your buzz by actually rocking the crowd and being on the road. Now these cats sit behind a computer and think it's grinding. Not to mention it's easy to create a buzz for yourself online by fudging with number of views, downloads etc.

It works both ways though. The radio is force feeding whack ass, boring commercial artists so why not give all an equal shot at breaking a hit record?

I agree you don't need radio to blow but it's still a strong tool to make that happen. The guys you mentioned are either White or connected to some of the most commercially successful artists in Rap. So, I wouldn't think radio would be that big of a deal.

You can't compare radio now to radio back in the day, the paradigm has changed. Music isn't selling like how it use to and the music business is not the same.

Ya'll give the radio way too much power, NO AMOUNT OF FORCE FEEDING IS EVER GOING TO MAKE SEAN PRICE, CURRENSY, SKYZOO,ETC RELEVANT OR POPULAR. Ya'll over simplify the music business way too much imo, some artist just don't have that ''it factor'' to ever translate on a commercial level. I don't care if you give them a Timbaland beat and a mil promotion budget.

As for boring commercial artist, they clearly aren't boring to the mass public if they are selling millions. Who the fuck is really the boring one if you can't translate to nothing but a niche audience (undergound music fans)?

IMO most of these underground artist lack something. They either have no ''it'' factor or they just aren't good song makers, when i say song makers i mean write catchy hooks, choruses, and pick beats.

You look at the niggas who made it from the underground (Jay, Em, Nas, Big,etc), they all were great writers and knew how to make catchy tunes.

Radio works exactly how it did 50-60 years ago. A dude with some dough walks in and hands the DJ some money and they play an artists music it really is that basic. So, perhaps nowadays the dude with some dough happens to have beats headphones or vouchers to footlocker but the process is the same. You are trying to diminish the power of radio when, radio is clearly one of the strongest tolls a an artist can use to make it big. That's why these new artists are clamoring to get on the radio not to mention the paper that comes from the spins you get. I am not saying that radio WILL blow any of the artists you mentioned point being you won't know if they arent being played 30 times a day. You are over simplifying the business by believing everyone that makes a hit or makes it big has some it factor. No they don't some of the success is, from force feeding from various media outlets radio included. Some from who an artists is associated with. Some from the budget they have to cultivate their product before the masses hear them. There are a number of factors not just the it factor.

What you believe as weak writing or not good song making is quite subjective. Considering what is on the radio majority of the time cannot be categorized as good songs. But I have been in this discussion with you before. You often imply because, something popular it is therefore greater then something that isn't as popular.

The dudes you mentioned that made it from the underground were heavenly involved in Payola, or had major connections via teir record labels and relationships with DJ's. It wasn't just HOW great they were\are.

 

[usmarin3]

LOL oversimplifying shit as usual. If it was that easy then why do most major label album release FLOP, do you know how many hundred of albums major labbels release every year and they fail commercially. In ya'll minds though ya'll seem to think it's just hit a platinum button in your office and wallah success.

You got artist like Christina Aquellera out here putting out two flop albums back to back and this bitch is on one of the biggest shows in the world right now.

Ya'll oversimplify shit way too much. There is no fomula of how to successfully break artist nowadays and radio play is no guarantee of anything.

 

[Meta_Conscious]

so what exactly is the purpose of radio? to indoctrinate the young, poor, uneducated masses? lololololoooolool

 

[usmarin3]

so what exactly is the purpose of radio? to indoctrinate the young, poor, uneducated masses? lololololoooolool

Radio is a private business, they aren't government ran entities. They don't owe the young, poor, uneducated,etc shit. It's just another platform for entertainment.

This argument is similar to the rappers kicking knowledge nonsense. No one is obligated to do shit for your taste, if you want to hear something, then what's stopping you from listening to it. Why are you waiting for radio or so and so commercial rapper to make ''knowledge raps'' for you.

 

[Meta_Conscious]

y u so quick to attack? I didn't say any of that... no one is attacking Jay z nigga... calm down... and fuck the radio and the lames who support it...

 

[usmarin3]

y u so quick to attack? I didn't say any of that... no one is attacking Jay z nigga... calm down... and fuck the radio and the lames who support it...

Then what's the purpose of this thread if ya'll are saying fuck the radio. Oh, it's fuck the radio, until my favorite underground rapper gets embraced by it. lol I see now!

 

[Kwan Dai]

I don't think you niggas understand the relationship of major labels and radio. Technically payola is illegal but the radio and labels have found a way around it with using a middle man. These labels pay the middle man and give labels their artist for things like Summer Jam, and big concerts.

Radio literally makes all it's money through advertisement and payola. What makes you think they're gonna work with some underground niggas, they have nothing to offer. Why do you think despite selling 100's of thousands you don't hear Mac Miller on the radio, because Mac isn't signed to a major. Kendrick, J Cole, Frank Ocean,etc have major distribution and some pull.

Why do you think majors are trying to sign Macklemore and Mac Miller, even though i think they are smart for staying indy.

I think most of us do understand this relationship and thus don't like commercial radio, commercial artists and commercial Hip hop.

Then why the fuck are ya'll crying? lmfao

You don't like commercial music, well fine don't listen to it, but don't get mad when the masses or radio doesn't give a fuck about mc such and such making niche music to a niche audience.

Why do you have to be such a goddamn clown? It's a discussion. If you are here to state the obvious why don't you move on? We understand the inherent issues with Radio and mass media that's what's being commented on.

Not people mad, crying etc etc. Grow up dude!

 

[usmarin3]

I don't think you niggas understand the relationship of major labels and radio. Technically payola is illegal but the radio and labels have found a way around it with using a middle man. These labels pay the middle man and give labels their artist for things like Summer Jam, and big concerts.

Radio literally makes all it's money through advertisement and payola. What makes you think they're gonna work with some underground niggas, they have nothing to offer. Why do you think despite selling 100's of thousands you don't hear Mac Miller on the radio, because Mac isn't signed to a major. Kendrick, J Cole, Frank Ocean,etc have major distribution and some pull.

Why do you think majors are trying to sign Macklemore and Mac Miller, even though i think they are smart for staying indy.

I think most of us do understand this relationship and thus don't like commercial radio, commercial artists and commercial Hip hop.

Then why the fuck are ya'll crying? lmfao

You don't like commercial music, well fine don't listen to it, but don't get mad when the masses or radio doesn't give a fuck about mc such and such making niche music to a niche audience.

Why do you have to be such a goddamn clown? It's a discussion. If you are here to state the obvious why don't you move on? We understand the inherent issues with Radio and mass media that's what's being commented on.

Not people mad, crying etc etc. Grow up dude!

I don't think you niggas understand the relationship of major labels and radio. Technically payola is illegal but the radio and labels have found a way around it with using a middle man. These labels pay the middle man and give labels their artist for things like Summer Jam, and big concerts.

Radio literally makes all it's money through advertisement and payola. What makes you think they're gonna work with some underground niggas, they have nothing to offer. Why do you think despite selling 100's of thousands you don't hear Mac Miller on the radio, because Mac isn't signed to a major. Kendrick, J Cole, Frank Ocean,etc have major distribution and some pull.

Why do you think majors are trying to sign Macklemore and Mac Miller, even though i think they are smart for staying indy.

I think most of us do understand this relationship and thus don't like commercial radio, commercial artists and commercial Hip hop.

Then why the fuck are ya'll crying? lmfao

You don't like commercial music, well fine don't listen to it, but don't get mad when the masses or radio doesn't give a fuck about mc such and such making niche music to a niche audience.

Why do you have to be such a goddamn clown? It's a discussion. If you are here to state the obvious why don't you move on? We understand the inherent issues with Radio and mass media that's what's being commented on.

Not people mad, crying etc etc. Grow up dude!

LOl at telling me to grow up, how about you stop being a hypocrite and stop with the double standards. You only have a problem with radio because what they do for artist you don't like, they don't do for artist you do like. I bet ya'll wouldn't have a problem with such and such underground rapper if they played their shit a million times a day like how they play someone mainstream like Lil Wayne.