Debt Talks Just got Real(er)

[kingblaze84]

Before I answer your question, I need you to back up your assertion that it is feasible to bring troops home now. How is this a factual argument and not one based on liberally idealistic perception.

I'd expect this train of thought from a back road conservative.

After the Vietnam War ended, what happened to America?? Nothing, no Vietnamese came to American shores to attack us. Again, the Middle East will hate us less when we stop sucking Israel's dick and change our foreign policy towards them. The more we leave the Middle East alone to their own issues, the less Middle Easterns and Arabs will want to kill us. It works very well for Sweden and Norway.

Continiuing George W Bush's policies is not bringing us peace. It's only bankrupting our future.

 

[kingblaze84]

You said it all my dude, but what niggas dont know that it wasnt just about the oil. They went in there and took all the antiquities
from the iraqi national museum. This nigga saddamn had cyclinder seals and artifacts from ancient mesopotamia, the powers that be HAD to get them. I believe to hide the truth or to use them for something. And just after the riots started in Egypt they had theyre antiquities looted. Coincidence?? I believe the uprising in Egypt was the work of provocateurs, most likely CIA or the moussaud(sp?)

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/04/12/king-tutankhamen-artifact_n_848422.html

LOL, some people here still believe we're in Iraq to stop Iran from taking over America!!!!!!!! And to fight Al Qaeda!!!! I think some people here still think we might be finding weapons of mass destruction anytime now haha

George W Bush and Donald Rumsfeld got some of these IC niggas shook loc!!!!!!!!!! LMAO!!!!

Who wouldv'e known Bush and Dick Cheney would have some fans on the Social Lounge till this day??

 

[janklow]

The world told America to wait until the UN inspectors finished searching before we go into war. The United Nations were talking to people on the ground in Iraq and were searching many places.

if you do not believe the inspectors were able to do this job successfully, you're not going to believe that they would be able to find weapons. this does not make it a lie, it makes it something people disagree about (and are supposed to debate the cases for/against).

Saddam did act shady at times, true, but MANY people all over the world act shady.

one key problem with Saddam being "shady" is that a) he'd played the game of "i have weapons if anyone fucks with me" for years, which means that even someone lying about it is doing their best to convince people it's true and b) he did once have said WMD.

Kim Jung 3rd and Mugabe are examples.

note that your first example is a guy who played the "secret weapons program" game as well and seems to have actually being legitimately working on one. which is not really a strong argument as to why people shouldn't have believed Saddam had weapons. Mugabe's a

Yet they havent been attacked LOL, I guess they dont have enough oil to steal.

if the issue was "getting Iraq's oil," purchasing it would have been cheaper than fighting a war to "steal it."

Iraq was a disaster and I wont give any man a pass for continuing it, just as GW loved to.

no one is saying you have to give anyone a "pass" for continuing it, but not liking it does not mean it was based on a lie.

We did it when we realized Vietnam was lost, and America turned out fine.

i'm curious as to when you think that was

Nothing, no Vietnamese came to American shores to attack us.

not really the point of the Vietnam War

You said it all my dude, but what niggas dont know that it wasnt just about the oil. They went in there and took all the antiquities

from the iraqi national museum. This nigga saddamn had cyclinder seals and artifacts from ancient mesopotamia, the powers that be HAD to get them. I believe to hide the truth or to use them for something. And just after the riots started in Egypt they had theyre antiquities looted. Coincidence?? I believe the uprising in Egypt was the work of provocateurs, most likely CIA or the moussaud(sp?)

ah, awesome, a terrible new INTERNET CONSPIRACY

 

[JadaRoss]

the gop suk assholes

 

[thatni99ajahmal]

LMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Dick Cheney, nigga is that you typing behind there???!!! Why the fuck do you care about what Iran does in its own backyard??? Playing the world's policeman is played out nigga!!!!

We wouldnt have to worry about Iran so much if we stopped butting our fucking busy body noses up in everyone's ass. Think for yourself and stop listening to Donald Rumsfeld.

How many times did you vote for Bush?

We have been the World's police for a good minute now..

Keeping Iran from destroying Iraq is beneficial whether you want to beleive it or not we will always need a hub to come in and whoop Iran ass if they ever got out of line which they are more than capable of doing and ready to do.. Having an "Ally" in Iraq and stable government is useful.. WMD was found in Iraq WMD isnt classified as big ass nuclear weapons dumb ass simply having the means to make them is all that is needed to be considered WMD.. When you get a top secret clearance to actually read some real shit let me know.. We are now at the mercy of the Iraqis if they dont want us here we will leave they have until November to make a decision..

 

[kingblaze84]

We have been the World's police for a good minute now..

Keeping Iran from destroying Iraq is beneficial whether you want to beleive it or not we will always need a hub to come in and whoop Iran ass if they ever got out of line which they are more than capable of doing and ready to do.. Having an "Ally" in Iraq and stable government is useful.. WMD was found in Iraq WMD isnt classified as big ass nuclear weapons dumb ass simply having the means to make them is all that is needed to be considered WMD.. When you get a top secret clearance to actually read some real shit let me know.. We are now at the mercy of the Iraqis if they dont want us here we will leave they have until November to make a decision..

You make me laugh. Iraq's govt is now close friends with the Iranian govt, so why would we worry about Iran destroying Iraq? That would be Iraq's fucking problem. And no you fucking idiot, there were never any wmds found there. The whole damn world has said this, and having the potential to build wmd doesnt mean anything when the UN inspectors didnt even get to finish doing their job. If we want to bomb nations for having the potential to build wmd, again, why wasnt North Korea bombed out? Ah yes, lack of oil supplies for American oil companies to take advantage of.

And I dont need top clearance to real shit, the world knows by now Saddam was not a threat to America. If you want your buddies to continue being blown the fuck up for corporate interests, be my guest. Those Iraqis dont like Americans and have zero reason to. I'll continue speaking out against the waste of my tax dollars, support neverending wars if you want to Dick Cheney.

 

[kingblaze84]

if you do not believe the inspectors were able to do this job successfully, you're not going to believe that they would be able to find weapons. this does not make it a lie, it makes it something people disagree about (and are supposed to debate the cases for/against).

one key problem with Saddam being "shady" is that a) he'd played the game of "i have weapons if anyone fucks with me" for years, which means that even someone lying about it is doing their best to convince people it's true and b) he did once have said WMD.

note that your first example is a guy who played the "secret weapons program" game as well and seems to have actually being legitimately working on one. which is not really a strong argument as to why people shouldn't have believed Saddam had weapons. Mugabe's a

if the issue was "getting Iraq's oil," purchasing it would have been cheaper than fighting a war to "steal it."

no one is saying you have to give anyone a "pass" for continuing it, but not liking it does not mean it was based on a lie.

i'm curious as to when you think that was

not really the point of the Vietnam War

ah, awesome, a terrible new INTERNET CONSPIRACY

Saddam did not want to sell oil using petrodollars. Once he stated this, his time was numbered. Do research on Saddam and his refusal to sell oil using petrodollars, you will learn a lot. SMH at you being one of the few people in the planet that still thinks going into Iraq was a good idea. 2 trillion dollars later and 4,000 Americans dead for what?

More hatred for America? That shit was worth it?

 

[tru_m.a.c]

After the Vietnam War ended, what happened to America?? Nothing

Its completely illogical to compare the consequences of the Vietnam War to the Consequences of the Iraq War/Afghanistan Campaign.

the Middle East will hate us less when we stop sucking Israel's dick and change our foreign policy towards them

This I can agree with you on to an extent. It's less about "sucking Israel's dick" because whether you want to admit it or not the entire Middle East region is ready to eliminate Israel. Backing away would just be inviting human rights violations and military escalations.

The more we leave the Middle East alone to their own issues, the less Middle Easterns and Arabs will want to kill us. It works very well for Sweden and Norway.

Continiuing George W Bush's policies is not bringing us peace. It's only bankrupting our future.

Philosophically you sound a peace loving liberal, but what you're suggesting goes against your own virtue. You want peace, yet America backing out of the Middle East will not bring peace. You cannot prove that America leaving will make the region a safer, less hostile region. That train of thought is an oversimplification of complex interconnected histories.

Just because everyone hates America doesn't mean everyone loves each other.

 

[thatni99ajahmal]

You make me laugh. Iraq's govt is now close friends with the Iranian govt, so why would we worry about Iran destroying Iraq? That would be Iraq's fucking problem. And no you fucking idiot, there were never any wmds found there. The whole damn world has said this, and having the potential to build wmd doesnt mean anything when the UN inspectors didnt even get to finish doing their job. If we want to bomb nations for having the potential to build wmd, again, why wasnt North Korea bombed out? Ah yes, lack of oil supplies for American oil companies to take advantage of.

And I dont need top clearance to real shit, the world knows by now Saddam was not a threat to America. If you want your buddies to continue being blown the fuck up for corporate interests, be my guest. Those Iraqis dont like Americans and have zero reason to. I'll continue speaking out against the waste of my tax dollars, support neverending wars if you want to Dick Cheney.

Your an idoit when it comes to this war shit but wateva its not your fault.. For one we are simply at a cease fire with North Korea which means war could kick off at any moment which is why are still in command of all the troops in South Korea including the Rok Army.. You simply think WMD is a big ass missile which is not which i have already explained to your simpleton ass.. Im tired of deploying to Middle East but i have read enough reports to understand why we are here and why there is a possiblity of us staying..I swear some ppl cant think logically.. We have pumped too much into Iraq beyond just war to just let it be crumbled..

 

[kingblaze84]

Its completely illogical to compare the consequences of the Vietnam War to the Consequences of the Iraq War/Afghanistan Campaign.

This I can agree with you on to an extent. It's less about "sucking Israel's dick" because whether you want to admit it or not the entire Middle East region is ready to eliminate Israel. Backing away would just be inviting human rights violations and military escalations.

Philosophically you sound a peace loving liberal, but what you're suggesting goes against your own virtue. You want peace, yet America backing out of the Middle East will not bring peace. You cannot prove that America leaving will make the region a safer, less hostile region. That train of thought is an oversimplification of complex interconnected histories.

Just because everyone hates America doesn't mean everyone loves each other.

Being Israel's bodyguard has only created hatred for America all over the Middle East. Israel is committing crimes against humanity on a daily basis and is constantly disregarding international law when it comes to its illegal settlements. Don't take my word for it, ask the United Nations and tons of NGOs all over the world that have backed me up. Protecting Israel's apartheid system in which Palestinians are kicked out of their homes to make way for illegal Jewish settlements is evil and gives America a negative reputation all over the Middle east, and invites terrorism. Your worldview is surprisingly short sighted, I expected a better post from you. I had no idea you supported apartheid.

And for the record I am not a liberal. I support the death penalty 100%, and wars IF they are for defense. I do not support wars that are all about robbing resources from native nations, something Dick Cheney, That NiggaJamal, Obama, and George W Bush support. If we're gonna be gangsta like that, than we should be upfront about it.

Creating jobs in Afghanistan and Iraq while cutting back on basic services and jobs in America is disgusting, and shame on you for supporting that.

 

[kingblaze84]

Your an idoit when it comes to this war shit but wateva its not your fault.. For one we are simply at a cease fire with North Korea which means war could kick off at any moment which is why are still in command of all the troops in South Korea including the Rok Army.. You simply think WMD is a big ass missile which is not which i have already explained to your simpleton ass.. Im tired of deploying to Middle East but i have read enough reports to understand why we are here and why there is a possiblity of us staying..I swear some ppl cant think logically.. We have pumped too much into Iraq beyond just war to just let it be crumbled..

Dick Cheney got your mind real good, didnt he? Haha........

I want you to show me one link that proves Iraq had WMD, just one. I understand Iraq had potential to build wmd but again, so do many other nations. North Korea has even more potential to build wmd and some say they already have it, so why not go to war with them right now? You're so damn gullible it's not even funny. You'd say the sky is green if Dick Cheney told you it was.

As far as Iraq is concerned, why should we care if it falls apart or not? We had no business going there to begin with but if you love neverending wars, knock yourself out. I hope the Iraqis DEFENDING their land from Americans dont take their anger out on you and your friends.

The Iraqis are a proud people, and dont like occupiers staying on their land for too long. If Bush, I mean Obama keeps our troops in Iraq past 2011, I hope you enjoy the wave of insurgent attacks coming your way. Enjoy

 

[thatni99ajahmal]

Dick Cheney got your mind real good, didnt he? Haha........

I want you to show me one link that proves Iraq had WMD, just one. I understand Iraq had potential to build wmd but again, so do many other nations. North Korea has even more potential to build wmd and some say they already have it, so why not go to war with them right now? You're so damn gullible it's not even funny. You'd say the sky is green if Dick Cheney told you it was.

Are you just ignoring everything i say?? I agree that we should have went to just Afghanistan BUT WE ARE HERE NOW so while we are here might as well fix some shit.. I just explained everything to you about North Korea we are on a CEASE FIRE WITH THEM and until they get out of line we will not break that.. You just agreed Iraq had the materials to make WMDs which is all that is needed to be considered WMD wtf is wrong with your comprehension..

As far as Iraq is concerned, why should we care if it falls apart or not? We had no business going there to begin with but if you love neverending wars, knock yourself out. I hope the Iraqis DEFENDING their land from Americans dont take their anger out on you and your friends.

The Iraqis are a proud people, and dont like occupiers staying on their land for too long. If Bush, I mean Obama keeps our troops in Iraq past 2011, I hope you enjoy the wave of insurgent attacks coming your way. Enjoy

Sunni and Kurds actually love Americans especially the Kurds which occupy Northern Iraq until you deploy and actually meet some Iraqis stfu.. If the president of Iraq wants us out all he has to do is say the word which he hasnt yet..

................

 

[janklow]

Saddam did not want to sell oil using petrodollars.

before i "do research on Saddam and his refusal to sell oil using petrodollars," explain to me how the request for me to do so addresses any of the things i said that you quoted

SMH at you being one of the few people in the planet that still thinks going into Iraq was a good idea. 2 trillion dollars later and 4,000 Americans dead for what?

is that what i said? no, wait, i said something about "sounds like the kind of thing that couldn't have been confirmed without the war." i got confused by the fact that what you're posting has almost nothing to do with what i posted

 

[kingblaze84]

................

Yeah, the Iraqis love Americans so much they're trying to bomb and kill them, as recently as last week lol. Kurds and Sunnis are both minority groups by the way.

We signed a deal with the Iraqi govt to leave by August of 2011, why are we still trying to stay? Many Iraqi groups have openly stated they will wage an open bloody war on Americans, even more violent than now, if Americans stay. Why risk it? We need to just leave, save our money, and spend money on American infrastructure, not Middle Eastern infrastructure. You think the Arab world appreciates Obama's efforts? You think the Middle East gives us props for our neverending wars there? Here are some funny poll numbers from the Middle East.....

http://www.miamiherald.com/2011/07/19/2321601/why-dont-arabs-love-obama-anymore.html

Why don't Arabs love Obama anymore?

By Lydia Mulvany
McClatchy Newspapers

WASHINGTON — President Barack Obama isn't living up to his promises in the Middle East, and it's driving Arab attitudes toward the United States to their lowest point in years, analysts say.

In an IBOPE Zogby International poll released last week, respondents in four out of six countries surveyed had a lower opinion of the United States than at the end of the Bush administration in 2008.

Of course, U.S. approval ratings in the region have been low for a long time. Arab opinion of the United States rose briefly after 9/11, then dropped with the invasion of Iraq.

Maya Berry, executive director of the Arab American Institute, said the message she took from the poll results was: Just stop interfering.

"There was a time when you'd get questions back, like we need you to lead here differently, or we need you to be balanced — that's just gone. Now it's just stay out of it," Berry said. "We are now reduced to interference."

--It's time to create jobs here at home, not create more terrorism and hatred overseas. America is not looked upon as a savior in the Middle East.

 

[kingblaze84]

before i "do research on Saddam and his refusal to sell oil using petrodollars," explain to me how the request for me to do so addresses any of the things i said that you quoted

is that what i said? no, wait, i said something about "sounds like the kind of thing that couldn't have been confirmed without the war." i got confused by the fact that what you're posting has almost nothing to do with what i posted

Well as long as you admit the wmd was never found there, it's all good. And Saddam's refusal to sell oil using petrodollars is the main reason we went into Iraq, second for American oil companies to go wild with Iraq's oil fields. Read this link........

http://prisonplanet.com/articles/february2006/170206dollar.htm

n November 2000, Iraq stopped accepting U.S. dollars for their oil. Counted as a purely political move, Saddam Hussein switched the currency required to purchase Iraqi oil to the euro. Selling oil through the U.N. Oil for Food Program, Iraq converted all of its U.S. dollars in its U.N. account to the euro. Shortly thereafter, Iraq converted $10 billion in their U.N. reserve fund to the euro. By the end of 2000, Iraq had abandoned the U.S. dollar completely.

Two months after the United States invaded Iraq, the Oil for Food Program was ended, the country’s accounts were switch back to dollars, and oil began to be sold once again for U.S. dollars. No longer could the world buy oil from Iraq with the euro. Universal global dollar supremacy was restored.

 

[tru_m.a.c]

Being Israel's bodyguard has only created hatred for America all over the Middle East. Israel is committing crimes against humanity on a daily basis and is constantly disregarding international law when it comes to its illegal settlements. Don't take my word for it, ask the United Nations and tons of NGOs all over the world that have backed me up. Protecting Israel's apartheid system in which Palestinians are kicked out of their homes to make way for illegal Jewish settlements is evil and gives America a negative reputation all over the Middle east, and invites terrorism. Your worldview is surprisingly short sighted, I expected a better post from you. I had no idea you supported apartheid.

This has nothing to do with supporting the Palestinians or Israel. My post has nothing to do with picking a side. My post has to do with what are you going to do, to stabilize that region, once America backs out. You have still not answered this fundamental question. Everything else you bring up does not touch on that main point. All you guys are doing is creating different arguments to prove a non contended point.

Again....once America backs out of the Middle East, what is going to happen?

 

[tru_m.a.c]

And for the record I am not a liberal. I support the death penalty 100%, and wars IF they are for defense. I do not support wars that are all about robbing resources from native nations, something Dick Cheney, That NiggaJamal, Obama, and George W Bush support. If we're gonna be gangsta like that, than we should be upfront about it.

But thats never going to happen. Its never happened. That is a stance America is never going to take.

Once you realize that, you'll see that poking America's "pride" and "ego" with lines like "if you're gangsta, be real" are pointless. Its a fuckn country, not a Stark.

 

[toktaylor]

Americas interest in the Middle-East is as follows:

• “Friends/Allies with Israel” – this is influenced by the many influential and wealthy Jews in the USA that forms a part of the USA top hierarchy.

• To take possession of or control of the oil that is there.

There is no other reasons….nuff said.

 

[thatni99ajahmal]

Yeah, the Iraqis love Americans so much they're trying to bomb and kill them, as recently as last week lol. Kurds and Sunnis are both minority groups by the way.

We signed a deal with the Iraqi govt to leave by August of 2011, why are we still trying to stay? Many Iraqi groups have openly stated they will wage an open bloody war on Americans, even more violent than now, if Americans stay. Why risk it? We need to just leave, save our money, and spend money on American infrastructure, not Middle Eastern infrastructure. You think the Arab world appreciates Obama's efforts? You think the Middle East gives us props for our neverending wars there? Here are some funny poll numbers from the Middle East.....

http://www.miamiherald.com/2011/07/19/2321601/why-dont-arabs-love-obama-anymore.html

Why don't Arabs love Obama anymore?

By Lydia Mulvany

McClatchy Newspapers

WASHINGTON — President Barack Obama isn't living up to his promises in the Middle East, and it's driving Arab attitudes toward the United States to their lowest point in years, analysts say.

In an IBOPE Zogby International poll released last week, respondents in four out of six countries surveyed had a lower opinion of the United States than at the end of the Bush administration in 2008.

Of course, U.S. approval ratings in the region have been low for a long time. Arab opinion of the United States rose briefly after 9/11, then dropped with the invasion of Iraq.

Maya Berry, executive director of the Arab American Institute, said the message she took from the poll results was: Just stop interfering.

"There was a time when you'd get questions back, like we need you to lead here differently, or we need you to be balanced — that's just gone. Now it's just stay out of it," Berry said. "We are now reduced to interference."

--It's time to create jobs here at home, not create more terrorism and hatred overseas. America is not looked upon as a savior in the Middle East.

Your hopeless bruh honestly..

It wasnt the Kurds or the Sunnis that attempted to bomb the American base they were Shiites FROM IRAN.. Im all for ending the war if it means we dont lose more soldiers lifes in the process.. The most violent it has been in Iraq recently has been bcuz of drawing down if that mean we have to withdrawl slowly and more cautiously to save lives then thats what we have to do.. Im all about creating jobs in America but ending these wars wont create a surplus of money.. They have tried the infrastructure stimulus and it didnt work bcuz the Republicans dont want to take money from the White House (President Obama).. I have told you plenty of times the DEADLINE IS NOVEMBER for the Iraqi government to say whether they want us to stay or not.. August is the start of withdrawl and breaking down bases in Iraq.. I really have nothing else to say either you get or you dont.. As far as ppl hating us overseas Americans protest soldiers deaths so i can give two shits about being hated..

 

[kingblaze84]

This has nothing to do with supporting the Palestinians or Israel. My post has nothing to do with picking a side. My post has to do with what are you going to do, to stabilize that region, once America backs out. You have still not answered this fundamental question. Everything else you bring up does not touch on that main point. All you guys are doing is creating different arguments to prove a non contended point.

Again....once America backs out of the Middle East, what is going to happen?

Once America stops interfering with everything the Middle East does, we can save more money and let the Middle East take care of their own issues.

Arabs are not babies, they are not children. They are human beings, and for the record, they have a very low crime rate compared to America. Once we leave them alone, America will be hated a lot less. Israel will go through hell, true, but that would be Israel's fault. We shouldnt be babysitting countries anyway, it's too expensive and we're going bankrupt doing so. We're 14 trillion dollars in debt, saving money should be a priority.

I'm about helping America save money to create jobs and opportunities here, not using that money to bomb civilians and create more terrorism. PERIOD.