who's owed more? natives for stolen land or blacks for forced free labor?

[blackgod813]

Native are owned more because it's their land and their numbers are low.

Black people are all over the world and we have a chance to turn it around but for the native they're done.

They can never recover

My nigga said its over!#!! Cot dam u took hope away...second theres seems to be a native click on this site...third is a mesicann indian i mean they gangs gets indian tatoos wats a native

..wat blood line is that mongloid idk :'(

 

[2stepz_ahead]

Negros win the 'who got it worse' Olympics 10 outta 10 times

Even in the holocaust we some how found a way to get our ass killed over shit we aint een involved in

Aint no kikes suffered during slavery

And indians had slaves themselves(so did other niggaz but u get my point)

I don't think any of the Natives had a system of Chattel slavery though just to be clear. So the Native slavery and American slavery aren't really comparable.

U aint injun

U aint know how they treated us

Shut up

No but other people are injuns and know how they treated us and wrote books. Try picking up one from time to time.

So i should get my history from the enemy

U musta got all A's in school.

Native are owned more because it's their land and their numbers are low

Black people are all over the world and we have a chance to turn it around but for the native they're done.

They can never recover

Low?

U see all these fuckin messicans runnin around?!

Aside from me, when was the last time you've met an Native American?

When was the last time you've even SEEN an Native American outside of a movie or Youtube video?

I'll wait...

my grandfather

So you're a Tribal man? What tribe you from?

I'm negro my tribe is North philly...

my grandfather came from crow

 

[2stepz_ahead]

why would you compare historical genocides ? thats silly

is it really?

I guess you skipped Jew class.

they bring the shit up over anything..

but niggas must keep silent?

not even a discussion?

*in trump voice*

sad

Its silly from them (jews) and its silly from you

you get nowhere by comparing tragedies. You can make a strong intelligent argument on what kind of reparations should or would African Americans receive without talking about other minority groups, its weak and counter productive.

silly?

unlike you. I can turn a "silly " discussion into a learning experience.

you debating me about a question that can spark debate and lead elsewhere without thinking of a bigger picture is counter productive.

even taking it smaller...

why can't a simple question be asked without a high horse nigga coming in?

why does this question bother you?

why didn't you just ignore it?

who's comparing tragedies? I said what was owed from what was stolen for free.

Jews still want money from Nazis from what was stolen, am I right?

so, what's your point again?

you ain't funny nigga...stop bringing uo old shit...

it's about this nigga...

 

[konceptjones]

Negros win the 'who got it worse' Olympics 10 outta 10 times

Even in the holocaust we some how found a way to get our ass killed over shit we aint een involved in

Aint no kikes suffered during slavery

And indians had slaves themselves(so did other niggaz but u get my point)

I don't think any of the Natives had a system of Chattel slavery though just to be clear. So the Native slavery and American slavery aren't really comparable.

U aint injun

U aint know how they treated us

Shut up

No but other people are injuns and know how they treated us and wrote books. Try picking up one from time to time.

So i should get my history from the enemy

U musta got all A's in school.

Native are owned more because it's their land and their numbers are low

Black people are all over the world and we have a chance to turn it around but for the native they're done.

They can never recover

Low?

U see all these fuckin messicans runnin around?!

Aside from me, when was the last time you've met an Native American?

When was the last time you've even SEEN an Native American outside of a movie or Youtube video?

I'll wait...

my grandfather

So you're a Tribal man? What tribe you from?

I'm negro my tribe is North philly...

my grandfather came from crow

If your grandfather was 100% Crow, that would make you 25% and eligible to be a tribal member as the Crow recognize down to 1/4 quantum blood. In some cases they'll accept you with even less than that.

Get your paperwork tight bruh and welcome to the family.

 

[gns]

Negros win the 'who got it worse' Olympics 10 outta 10 times

Even in the holocaust we some how found a way to get our ass killed over shit we aint een involved in

Aint no kikes suffered during slavery

And indians had slaves themselves(so did other niggaz but u get my point)

I don't think any of the Natives had a system of Chattel slavery though just to be clear. So the Native slavery and American slavery aren't really comparable.

U aint injun

U aint know how they treated us

Shut up

No but other people are injuns and know how they treated us and wrote books. Try picking up one from time to time.

So i should get my history from the enemy

U musta got all A's in school.

Native are owned more because it's their land and their numbers are low

Black people are all over the world and we have a chance to turn it around but for the native they're done.

They can never recover

Low?

U see all these fuckin messicans runnin around?!

Aside from me, when was the last time you've met an Native American?

When was the last time you've even SEEN an Native American outside of a movie or Youtube video?

I'll wait...

By home depot yesterday

Messicans are native americans u cant tell me shit

Y u think their birthrate is so high? Just like baby boomers after WW2

Messicans multiply like nobodies business because of being massacred by the pilgrims and shit

 

[The Lonious Monk]

Negros win the 'who got it worse' Olympics 10 outta 10 times

Even in the holocaust we some how found a way to get our ass killed over shit we aint een involved in

Aint no kikes suffered during slavery

And indians had slaves themselves(so did other niggaz but u get my point)

I don't think any of the Natives had a system of Chattel slavery though just to be clear. So the Native slavery and American slavery aren't really comparable.

U aint injun

U aint know how they treated us

Shut up

No but other people are injuns and know how they treated us and wrote books. Try picking up one from time to time.

So i should get my history from the enemy

U musta got all A's in school.

Native are owned more because it's their land and their numbers are low

Black people are all over the world and we have a chance to turn it around but for the native they're done.

They can never recover

Low?

U see all these fuckin messicans runnin around?!

Aside from me, when was the last time you've met an Native American?

When was the last time you've even SEEN an Native American outside of a movie or Youtube video?

I'll wait...

By home depot yesterday

Messicans are native americans u cant tell me shit

Y u think their birthrate is so high? Just like baby boomers after WW2

Messicans multiply like nobodies business because of being massacred by the pilgrims and shit

Most Mexicans have Native blood, but most of them are mixed. On top of that, they probably treat their indigenous people (the ones that never bought into Spanish culture) arguably worse than the U.S. treats the Natives here.

 

[NoCompetition]

There are some things about the reparations subject I have thought about. Its not something I think about too much because my thing is get mine and try to take advantage of what is here so Im not the type to put energy into that. But a few things. Who would get them and how? How much? Who can say what is owed?Who knows what somebody's particular ancestor went through? etc. I know of many black people who owned big land back then. Im talking great great grandparents and even further back. Owned more than their offspring now...so who is that on? Or at least who has at least their part of the "blame".

So just anybody "Black" would get it? Eh, I dont hold my breath on that. So what would the proving process be? How do you assess a dollar amount? What time period are we talking? etc. People say no one from way back who may have been victimized and due it are alive today. Not that Im against it but just some considerations about the subject. No problem with those who may be exploring/promoting this issue.

 

[Maximus Rex]

Who are owed more Indians or blacks?

1672 - Legislators also offer a reward to Indians who capture escaped slaves and return them to a justice of the peace.
http://www.history.org/history/teaching/slavelaw.cfm

Cherokee Nation Expels Descendants Of Tribe’s Black Slaves
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/08/25/cherokee-nations-expels-d_n_936930.html

After a long legal fight, the Cherokee nation ousted thousands of descendants of black slaves who had long been official members of the tribe.

The Cherokee Supreme Court (the tribe is a sovereign nation) ruled this week a 2007 constitutional amendment that required Cherokee blood in order to belong to the tribe could stand.

“This is racism and apartheid in the 21st century,” Marilyn Vann, the lead plaintiff in the case and a freedman leader, told Reuters.

The controversy over the freedmen’s status is at least in part about money. The Cherokee nation, the second-largest Native American tribe in the country, receives money from the federal government and earns money from its stake in the lucrative gambling industry, which totaled $26.4 billion for all tribes in 2009. In the run-up to the 2007 amendment vote, some proponents of expelling the freedmen suggested that more blacks might apply for membership to receive tribal money.

In the 1800s, the U.S. government passed a law forcing members of the Cherokee nation from their ancestral lands in the Deep South to make room for white settlers. The Cherokee — as well as their black slaves — were forcibly marched west of the Mississippi River to the Oklahoma territory during the “Trail of Tears,” resulting in the deaths of thousands of Native Americans.

After the Civil War, the Cherokee formally admitted by treaty their slaves’ descendants into the nation.

Before the 2007 passage of the amendment, some descendants of the freedmen said the vote on their status within the nation expressed a desire by many tribe members to paper over their slave-owning past. But the tribe’s leadership disagreed. “It’s a basic, inherent right to determine our own citizenry,” a Cherokee leader told the Washington Post. “We paid very dearly for those rights.”

You tell me.

 

[konceptjones]

Who are owed more Indians or blacks?

1672 - Legislators also offer a reward to Indians who capture escaped slaves and return them to a justice of the peace.
http://www.history.org/history/teaching/slavelaw.cfm

Cherokee Nation Expels Descendants Of Tribe’s Black Slaves
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/08/25/cherokee-nations-expels-d_n_936930.html

After a long legal fight, the Cherokee nation ousted thousands of descendants of black slaves who had long been official members of the tribe.

The Cherokee Supreme Court (the tribe is a sovereign nation) ruled this week a 2007 constitutional amendment that required Cherokee blood in order to belong to the tribe could stand.

“This is racism and apartheid in the 21st century,” Marilyn Vann, the lead plaintiff in the case and a freedman leader, told Reuters.

The controversy over the freedmen’s status is at least in part about money. The Cherokee nation, the second-largest Native American tribe in the country, receives money from the federal government and earns money from its stake in the lucrative gambling industry, which totaled $26.4 billion for all tribes in 2009. In the run-up to the 2007 amendment vote, some proponents of expelling the freedmen suggested that more blacks might apply for membership to receive tribal money.

In the 1800s, the U.S. government passed a law forcing members of the Cherokee nation from their ancestral lands in the Deep South to make room for white settlers. The Cherokee — as well as their black slaves — were forcibly marched west of the Mississippi River to the Oklahoma territory during the “Trail of Tears,” resulting in the deaths of thousands of Native Americans.

After the Civil War, the Cherokee formally admitted by treaty their slaves’ descendants into the nation.

Before the 2007 passage of the amendment, some descendants of the freedmen said the vote on their status within the nation expressed a desire by many tribe members to paper over their slave-owning past. But the tribe’s leadership disagreed. “It’s a basic, inherent right to determine our own citizenry,” a Cherokee leader told the Washington Post. “We paid very dearly for those rights.”

You tell me.

yes, because all Native Americans were Cherokee...

 

[2stepz_ahead]

Who are owed more Indians or blacks?

1672 - Legislators also offer a reward to Indians who capture escaped slaves and return them to a justice of the peace.
http://www.history.org/history/teaching/slavelaw.cfm

Cherokee Nation Expels Descendants Of Tribe’s Black Slaves
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/08/25/cherokee-nations-expels-d_n_936930.html

After a long legal fight, the Cherokee nation ousted thousands of descendants of black slaves who had long been official members of the tribe.

The Cherokee Supreme Court (the tribe is a sovereign nation) ruled this week a 2007 constitutional amendment that required Cherokee blood in order to belong to the tribe could stand.

“This is racism and apartheid in the 21st century,” Marilyn Vann, the lead plaintiff in the case and a freedman leader, told Reuters.

The controversy over the freedmen’s status is at least in part about money. The Cherokee nation, the second-largest Native American tribe in the country, receives money from the federal government and earns money from its stake in the lucrative gambling industry, which totaled $26.4 billion for all tribes in 2009. In the run-up to the 2007 amendment vote, some proponents of expelling the freedmen suggested that more blacks might apply for membership to receive tribal money.

In the 1800s, the U.S. government passed a law forcing members of the Cherokee nation from their ancestral lands in the Deep South to make room for white settlers. The Cherokee — as well as their black slaves — were forcibly marched west of the Mississippi River to the Oklahoma territory during the “Trail of Tears,” resulting in the deaths of thousands of Native Americans.

After the Civil War, the Cherokee formally admitted by treaty their slaves’ descendants into the nation.

Before the 2007 passage of the amendment, some descendants of the freedmen said the vote on their status within the nation expressed a desire by many tribe members to paper over their slave-owning past. But the tribe’s leadership disagreed. “It’s a basic, inherent right to determine our own citizenry,” a Cherokee leader told the Washington Post. “We paid very dearly for those rights.”

You tell me.

yes, because all Native Americans were Cherokee...

you can't say that, eagle feather

 

[Maximus Rex]

There are some things about the reparations subject I have thought about. Its not something I think about too much because my thing is get mine and try to take advantage of what is here so Im not the type to put energy into that. But a few things. Who would get them and how? How much? Who can say what is owed? Who knows what somebody's particular ancestor went through? etc. I know of many black people who owned big land back then. I'm talking great great grandparents and even further back. Owned more than their offspring now...so who is that on? Or at least who has at least their part of the "blame".

So just anybody "Black" would get it? Eh, I dont hold my breath on that. So what would the proving process be? How do you assess a dollar amount? What time period are we talking? etc. People say no one from way back who may have been victimized and due it are alive today. Not that Im against it but just some considerations about the subject. No problem with those who may be exploring/promoting this issue.

You know that black people are owned reparations who things other than slavery, right? For instance, right after Reconstruction white racist CAC's instituted the convict lease system. This system allowed for prisons to lease prisoners to racist white supremacist CAC land owners and corporations. As a result they were locking black men up for vagrancy, riding the rails, gambling, carrying guns, and of course some made up shit. The vagrancy laws were the 19th Century version of "stop-and-frisk." A dude could literally be walking down the street, and the racist white supremacist CAC would stop accost potna ask him what he was doing and lock him up. Back then black didn't have freedom of movement and needed notes from white people stating what they were doing. Also, black would ride the rails looking for work, being that they were poor and didn't have money for a train ticket they would do that hobo shit. The racist white supremacists CACs would raid the trains and lock brothers up. Once locked up the brothers would be fined. Since they were poor they didn't have the money to pay the fine. A racist white supremacist land/ business owner or corporation would pay the fine and the brothers would be forced to "work," off the fine. The convict lease system was actually worse than slavery because at least in slavery, the racist white supremacist slaver would have vested maintaining his property where as with the convict leasing, they just worked muthafuckas to death and kept the brothers and sisters in horrid conditions. When they convicts would die, they just would buy new convicts. This hellish sick ass system lasted until the onset of the WWII and was only ended because the government didn't want the Axis to use it as a propaganda tool. The infrastructure of the South was built with this system and U.S. Steel benefited immensely from this fucked up remix version of slavery. I highly suggest this book.

Then there's this.

As we all know our economic based was repeatedly devastated on the word of some racist white supremacist female screaming rape. Racist white supremacist savages would rampage through our parts of town destroying everything in sight. Descendants of black business owners who lost their livelihoods are owned reparations and the lost of the business should be adjusted for inflation.

Then there's the policy of Benign Neglect which is one of the reasons why our communities are fucked up today.

At that historical juncture, Moynihan declared, Americans needed “a period in which Negro progress” continued and “racial rhetoric” faded. Moynihan believed that the antipoverty programs of the “Great Society” of the 1960s had failed miserably, not only because they had attempted to use money alone to solve the nation’s inability to properly educate the African American poor but also because they did not raise issues in reference to the viability of integration as a solution to U.S. racial problems. To most liberals—especially many civil rights leaders of the period—Moynihan had provided the rationalization for what Swedish political economist Gunnar Myrdal, in his classic An American Dilemma (1944), labeled a “laissez-faire” or “do-nothing” approach to racial problems.http://www.encyclopedia.com/history/united-states-and-canada/us-history/benign-neglect

Coupled with benign neglect, black people are owned reparations for the devastating effects of the Drug War. When World War II ended, the Marshall Plan was enacted to rebuild Europe, we need an urban Marshall Plan. Reparations don't have to be a check per se, but something like fully funding inner city schools and teaching STEM subjects do that we don't have to import Dotheads. Giving SBA loans to graduates of HBCUs or residents of certain neighborhoods who can prove they've live in "x" neighborhood for say 15 years. Fully funding HBCU's. You have to be careful about saying shit is specifically for black because there would be a court challenge based on violating the 14th Amendment.

 

[2stepz_ahead]

I'm glad Tulsa was brought up...we gonna have a mock trial to determine what is owed to the descendants

 

[ghostdog56]

Black people are owed more because them Indians trusting them crackers is what paved the way for us to be brought here in the first place

 

[konceptjones]

Who are owed more Indians or blacks?

1672 - Legislators also offer a reward to Indians who capture escaped slaves and return them to a justice of the peace.
http://www.history.org/history/teaching/slavelaw.cfm

Cherokee Nation Expels Descendants Of Tribe’s Black Slaves
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/08/25/cherokee-nations-expels-d_n_936930.html

After a long legal fight, the Cherokee nation ousted thousands of descendants of black slaves who had long been official members of the tribe.

The Cherokee Supreme Court (the tribe is a sovereign nation) ruled this week a 2007 constitutional amendment that required Cherokee blood in order to belong to the tribe could stand.

“This is racism and apartheid in the 21st century,” Marilyn Vann, the lead plaintiff in the case and a freedman leader, told Reuters.

The controversy over the freedmen’s status is at least in part about money. The Cherokee nation, the second-largest Native American tribe in the country, receives money from the federal government and earns money from its stake in the lucrative gambling industry, which totaled $26.4 billion for all tribes in 2009. In the run-up to the 2007 amendment vote, some proponents of expelling the freedmen suggested that more blacks might apply for membership to receive tribal money.

In the 1800s, the U.S. government passed a law forcing members of the Cherokee nation from their ancestral lands in the Deep South to make room for white settlers. The Cherokee — as well as their black slaves — were forcibly marched west of the Mississippi River to the Oklahoma territory during the “Trail of Tears,” resulting in the deaths of thousands of Native Americans.

After the Civil War, the Cherokee formally admitted by treaty their slaves’ descendants into the nation.

Before the 2007 passage of the amendment, some descendants of the freedmen said the vote on their status within the nation expressed a desire by many tribe members to paper over their slave-owning past. But the tribe’s leadership disagreed. “It’s a basic, inherent right to determine our own citizenry,” a Cherokee leader told the Washington Post. “We paid very dearly for those rights.”

You tell me.

yes, because all Native Americans were Cherokee...

you can't say that, eagle feather

The Black side of me can. Biracial for the win!

 

[konceptjones]

Black people are owed more because them Indians trusting them crackers is what paved the way for us to be brought here in the first place

The Atlantic Slave Trade truthfully started in 1493 when Columbus began shipping Natives back to Europe. This was over 100 years before the first colonists at Jamestown in 1607 and before the first Africans were brought over as slaves in 1619. By the time the first Africans had been brought here nearly one million Natives had been captured and shipped back to Europe in chains and many more were already being forced to work as slaves in the islands and central America. However, the oldest European settlement in this country, San Agustin in what would eventually be known as Florida, had Europeans that were using Natives as slaves as far back as 1565.

Natives were the first people enslaved here.

 

[D. Morgan]

why would you compare historical genocides ? thats silly

is it really?

I guess you skipped Jew class.

they bring the shit up over anything..

but niggas must keep silent?

not even a discussion?

*in trump voice*

sad

Its silly from them (jews) and its silly from you

you get nowhere by comparing tragedies. You can make a strong intelligent argument on what kind of reparations should or would African Americans receive without talking about other minority groups, its weak and counter productive.

silly?

unlike you. I can turn a "silly " discussion into a learning experience.

you debating me about a question that can spark debate and lead elsewhere without thinking of a bigger picture is counter productive.

even taking it smaller...

why can't a simple question be asked without a high horse nigga coming in?

why does this question bother you?

why didn't you just ignore it?

who's comparing tragedies? I said what was owed from what was stolen for free.

Jews still want money from Nazis from what was stolen, am I right?

so, what's your point again?

you ain't funny nigga...stop bringing uo old shit...

it's about this nigga...

I ain't trying to be funny. Just pointing the FACT that its crazy as shit for you to question that nigga on same shit that you do all the fucking time all over this whole forum.

 

[Stomp Johnson]

Land vs labor

Location vs workforce

Hmmm....lemme ponder this. I shall return.

 

[huey]

Reservations are horrible

 

[Kwan Dai]

I hate to compare atrocities. So, I won't.

Blacks are owed more and it's not even close. Not just because of Free Labor or the violence of slavery, and Jim crow but for what we have done despite these things. There is no ETHNIC group in this godforsaken country that has done more for freedom, justice and equality for all. While we were and continue getting our asses kicked we continue to include all persecuted, and disenfranchised people in our struggle. All the while these motherfuckers ever rarely give a damn about us. Even Indians now infested with cracker blood through rape and incest have cut ties with Blacks who are descendants of natives. Every non-white ethnic group in this country owes their god damn existence in America to Blacks.

 

[2stepz_ahead]

why would you compare historical genocides ? thats silly

is it really?

I guess you skipped Jew class.

they bring the shit up over anything..

but niggas must keep silent?

not even a discussion?

*in trump voice*

sad

Its silly from them (jews) and its silly from you

you get nowhere by comparing tragedies. You can make a strong intelligent argument on what kind of reparations should or would African Americans receive without talking about other minority groups, its weak and counter productive.

silly?

unlike you. I can turn a "silly " discussion into a learning experience.

you debating me about a question that can spark debate and lead elsewhere without thinking of a bigger picture is counter productive.

even taking it smaller...

why can't a simple question be asked without a high horse nigga coming in?

why does this question bother you?

why didn't you just ignore it?

who's comparing tragedies? I said what was owed from what was stolen for free.

Jews still want money from Nazis from what was stolen, am I right?

so, what's your point again?

you ain't funny nigga...stop bringing uo old shit...

it's about this nigga...

I ain't trying to be funny. Just pointing the FACT that its crazy as shit for you to question that nigga on same shit that you do all the fucking time all over this whole forum.

so you critiquing my posting style?

get off your high horse nigga