Questions and Statements about God...

[whar67]

There is a tradition of christianity, Gnostic, which holds that God is evil. The universe was created by this evil god, also called the Demiurge, and he demands to be worship, however there exists truth beyond this God that the gnostic worship. This truth this their true God and called my many names in gnostic traditions, Bythos and Monad for instance. I find the gnostics interesting because their faith eliminates many of the paradoxes that exists in most modern faiths, chiefly the existence of imperfection in creation by a perfect creator. Since the creator God or Demiurge created for his own power and without care for us the universes structure make sense in this religion.

 

[tri3w]

I think Alot OF ur r taking th Verse out of Context and Extremely Distorting their meaning

 

[TX_Made713]

I leave for a while and come back to this hoggwash?

 

[TX_Made713]

was dinosaurs a mistake?

how could dinosaurs be a mistake when half the shit we use came from their poop/remains (desks, oil, etc)

 

[TX_Made713]

Welcome to religion

 

[kingjust627]

There is no god, there is no devil, there is no heaven nor hell (and our lineage does not go back to adam-n-eve)... everyones interpretations of such things vary and is not an adherence to all. But, since no one is willing to give this "god" any attributions to be ridiculed, analyzed, criticized or praised, he/she/it will remain on the fringe of a fairytale wanting to be true. Do not speak for him/her/it, cuz deep down, you really don't know... but are not honest enough to say so. So, is 'god' evil... who knows; if you believe or are a believer, then ask him/her/it why all of the fucked up shit happened while you were here when you die (because that's what you believe), if you don't believe... then it really doesn't matter does it? And for the first sentence posted... because I say so. LOL Also, someone posted up in another thread that religion slows progress... well, this would be a perfect example. I'm sure there are some highly intelligent people here, possibly certified geniuses. But when the focus of your attention is the supernatural, which does no good in the overall scheme of things for humanity... well you figure it out. You all argue, profess, and proclaim about this and that... which brigns segregation amongst us. Sounds like regression to me. One of you could come up with the cure for aids, maybe cancer... but you choose religion as your discipline. Prayer has never healed or cured someone with those illnesses which I think would be more important then saving a proverbial soul (another untangible, unproven, unobtanium of sorts). Maybe it gave them comfort before they depart because of the allegorical symbolism and their own fear of death, but I stated healed or cured. Maybe one of you could do or go into the field of molecular biology and find the trait that causes cleft palates, heart conditions, autism, down syndrom, etc. and prevent babies from being born with such disabilities. But nope, you choose religion over those things. Seems quite more selfish and selfcentered to not try and utilize an unfounded genius in you for a 'belief' which is not tangible as would be a cure for the 21st century plague... amongst other things. Oh well...

 

[alissowack]

There is no god, there is no devil, there is no heaven nor hell (and our lineage does not go back to adam-n-eve)... everyones interpretations of such things vary and is not an adherence to all. But, since no one is willing to give this "god" any attributions to be ridiculed, analyzed, criticized or praised, he/she/it will remain on the fringe of a fairytale wanting to be true. Do not speak for him/her/it, cuz deep down, you really don't know... but are not honest enough to say so. So, is 'god' evil... who knows; if you believe or are a believer, then ask him/her/it why all of the fucked up shit happened while you were here when you die (because that's what you believe), if you don't believe... then it really doesn't matter does it? And for the first sentence posted... because I say so. LOL Also, someone posted up in another thread that religion slows progress... well, this would be a perfect example. I'm sure there are some highly intelligent people here, possibly certified geniuses. But when the focus of your attention is the supernatural, which does no good in the overall scheme of things for humanity... well you figure it out. You all argue, profess, and proclaim about this and that... which brigns segregation amongst us. Sounds like regression to me. One of you could come up with the cure for aids, maybe cancer... but you choose religion as your discipline. Prayer has never healed or cured someone with those illnesses which I think would be more important then saving a proverbial soul (another untangible, unproven, unobtanium of sorts). Maybe it gave them comfort before they depart because of the allegorical symbolism and their own fear of death, but I stated healed or cured. Maybe one of you could do or go into the field of molecular biology and find the trait that causes cleft palates, heart conditions, autism, down syndrom, etc. and prevent babies from being born with such disabilities. But nope, you choose religion over those things. Seems quite more selfish and selfcentered to not try and utilize an unfounded genius in you for a 'belief' which is not tangible as would be a cure for the 21st century plague... amongst other things. Oh well...

I would have to turn this around and use the same reasoning you have for a deity's non-existence: If God exists, does it matter what anybody thinks? Even if there is proof of a deity (though I prefer to say that Bible is evidence), is it fair to say we "know"? Believers and non-believers alike bring about regression and segregation upon ourselves for thinking we are right in our assumptions. If God exists, then we are all at His Mercy. As bad as suffering is and the symptoms of it, who are we to say that it not for our good? I would even have to say it may just take suffering to bring about good. Pain and suffering isn't such a bad thing if learn something good from it.

 

[whar67]

Unfortunately, evil and suffering exist and it is tragic to see how things have been going with Haiti. But, does it means that God made a mistake in this? Is it possible that maybe in this tragedy, that God is preparing something good or even testing those who think they know God? Nowadays, God isn't being believed in, it is being sold and people are looking at religions (especially Christianity) as a product that just doesn't work.

Most folks give God the following powers/abilities

All-Powerful

All-Knowing

All-Loving

If you hold these to be true the paradoxes these trait produce needs to be explained.

1. "God is preparing something good" - If God is All-Powerful then he could achieve whatever good he wanted without killing people.

2. "Testing those who think they know God" - A test is preform to learn something. A teacher test his students to see if they understand the material, but God is All-Knowing at any given time he know exactly what his child comprehend and believe. If instead the test is for the student to learn something then God being All-Powerful can teach what he needs without killing children.

 

[alissowack]

Most folks give God the following powers/abilities

All-Powerful

All-Knowing

All-Loving

If you hold these to be true the paradoxes these trait produce needs to be explained.

1. "God is preparing something good" - If God is All-Powerful then he could achieve whatever good he wanted without killing people.

2. "Testing those who think they know God" - A test is preform to learn something. A teacher test his students to see if they understand the material, but God is All-Knowing at any given time he know exactly what his child comprehend and believe. If instead the test is for the student to learn something then God being All-Powerful can teach what he needs without killing children.

Is it fair to say that we "know" what all-powerful, all-knowing, and all-loving means according to God? I can say whatever I want to say about God by it doesn't mean that God and I are in agreence. It doesn't mean I "know the facts". I believe that God is not interested in the tests we all are trying to run on Him. According to the Bible, those tests have already been done and we still don't believe. The Bible simply says for us to believe that when God says He is God, then He means it. It is a matter of trust; a matter of faith.

 

[whar67]

I know what they mean to humans. I know what the tragedy of an earthquake, tidal wave, or hurricane mean. And I know that no God can exist that has those three traits as human define them and allow the world to operate as it does. The paradoxes are too many either God loves us but is not as powerful as we give him credit or is that powerful but does not love us. (Equally he does not hate us but would seem to be indifferent.)

 

[alissowack]

I know what they mean to humans. I know what the tragedy of an earthquake, tidal wave, or hurricane mean. And I know that no God can exist that has those three traits as human define them and allow the world to operate as it does. The paradoxes are too many either God loves us but is not as powerful as we give him credit or is that powerful but does not love us. (Equally he does not hate us but would seem to be indifferent.)

Those concerns are no different from the ones raised in the Bible. Have you ever read what really happened in the story of Moses? Most of us have the notion that Moses and God's people lived happily ever after when Moses was given power to part the Red Sea. After "the show was over", the Israelites still had reason complain. God had lead Moses and the Israelites into the dessert for a long time. The Israelites were hungry and thirsty and complained about it to Moses in effect saying,"If your God is who you say He is Moses, then why hasn't he fed us? We would rather still be slaves under Pharaoh than to go this." not taking into consideration what they witness happen in being liberated from Pharaoh. The Israelites put such pressure on Mose to conjure up another miracle that he disobeyed God in there process. God still allowed Moses to lead them into the Promise Land but because of his "lack of faith", he was not allowed to enter in with them.

Even if God were to miraculously exhibit those attributes to you now, you still wouldn't believe in Him. You will see the miracles for something other than that.

 

[And Step]

Lucifer according to Christians is an evil being responsible for much of the suffering in the world....why can't God at least correct his mistake of creating him? Oh wait, you're going to say Lucifer is all part of God's plan......what a sick, twisted fuck you have as a god. SMH

Not neccesarily. Lucifer is not responsible for suffering. According to the scriptures used by Christians he just makes suggestions and people choose to follow it or not. And yes, Lucifer is part of God's Plan. If a drug dealer approaches you and asks you to join the trade that causes death and destruction is it his fault or is it your if you acquiesce?
I put my son through the wringer because I know as a young black male he is not going to have it easy and is not going to be handed anything. I do that so he doesn't expect a handout or an easy way out. He must learn to face difficulty and overcome it. My motto with him is no excuses and make it happen. Man can't be elevated or perfected if everything is easy. The sick fucks are the ones who baby their children and make it easy for them causing extreme inadequacies and failure down the road.

Not a Christian but I do believe in Christ.

 

[whar67]

Those concerns are no different from the ones raised in the Bible. Have you ever read what really happened in the story of Moses? Most of us have the notion that Moses and God's people lived happily ever after when Moses was given power to part the Red Sea. After "the show was over", the Israelites still had reason complain. God had lead Moses and the Israelites into the dessert for a long time. The Israelites were hungry and thirsty and complained about it to Moses in effect saying,"If your God is who you say He is Moses, then why hasn't he fed us? We would rather still be slaves under Pharaoh than to go this." not taking into consideration what they witness happen in being liberated from Pharaoh. The Israelites put such pressure on Mose to conjure up another miracle that he disobeyed God in there process. God still allowed Moses to lead them into the Promise Land but because of his "lack of faith", he was not allowed to enter in with them.

Even if God were to miraculously exhibit those attributes to you now, you still wouldn't believe in Him. You will see the miracles for something other than that.

If God had built a reality where the traits we assigned him did not lead to impossible outcomes it would remove the biggest reason I no longer believe. It is not that I need to see miracles to believe but an explainations for the rest of reality I see. Curiously you never see an answer from the religious perspective to my original point. Even in your response you point out that those that ask the question are punished, forced to wander the desert for fourty years. Eventually they will see the land of milk and honey ... so long as they remember to obey and not question this perfectly loving being called God.

 

[And Step]

there is only one world that man KNOWS about, and thats earth.

Actually, World and Earth are not synonymous. You should have said Planets instead of world. Man knows many worlds. Worlds implies systems of doing things. Business World, Science World, Sports world, etc..

But you would have been mistaken in that instance too. Man knows there is life forms on other planets. Water which is the basis of all life has been found on other places. Sure we may not know the depth of life but Man knows a lo and is still learning. Some of it is hidden from the public.

 

[alissowack]

If God had built a reality where the traits we assigned him did not lead to impossible outcomes it would remove the biggest reason I no longer believe. It is not that I need to see miracles to believe but an explainations for the rest of reality I see. Curiously you never see an answer from the religious perspective to my original point. Even in your response you point out that those that ask the question are punished, forced to wander the desert for fourty years. Eventually they will see the land of milk and honey ... so long as they remember to obey and not question this perfectly loving being called God.

It not about the miraculous outcomes. God could just give us that reality where we are introduced to the facts and God is present (though Jesus is said to be God Incarnate). The world won't choose God regardless...not willingly. Who are we to say that the Israelite's "wandering" is punishment if God exists. It sure reads that way but who are we to determine that?

 

[tri3w]

]Not neccesarily. Lucifer is not responsible for suffering. According to the scriptures used by Christians he just makes suggestions and people choose to follow it or not[/B]. And yes, Lucifer is part of God's Plan. If a drug dealer approaches you and asks you to join the trade that causes death and destruction is it his fault or is it your if you acquiesce?

I put my son through the wringer because I know as a young black male he is not going to have it easy and is not going to be handed anything. I do that so he doesn't expect a handout or an easy way out. He must learn to face difficulty and overcome it. My motto with him is no excuses and make it happen. Man can't be elevated or perfected if everything is easy. The sick fucks are the ones who baby their children and make it easy for them causing extreme inadequacies and failure down the road.

Not a Christian but I do believe in Christ.

He Not???.........What happed 2 "He's like a roaring lion seeking whom he may devor"???

 

[kingblaze84]

what are you talking about ?? LOL first you were talking about god preserving the truth etc .. now ur talking about evolution and faith ....LOL what are we discussing here

this is what you said "I believe God wasn't fearing for His Life but He understood what He stood for; what He represented (in this case, what God represented was who He was and is). The truth is more in danger than His Life. God gave His Life through His Son so that we may still have a chance to know the Truth."

now what im saying is it doesnt make sense. how can the devil hide the truth of god from people??? all god has to do is talk to us the same way he talked to moses, noah, and everybody else. its funny how people put faith as their number 1 priority. based on your beliefs, what you just said is blasphemy!!! ....

god doesnt need or want anything right?? so how can god need or want to "preserve the truth"?? he doesnt have to ... he can bring the truth and destroy the devil "within a blinking of an eye" by your own definition of faith .... you are contradicting your own self

yes there are thing we dont know about life and "god" etc etc .... but my whole thing is, even if the things you say are true, you still dont follow them no matter how simple they are. god tells you things according to your own beliefs, then when someone questions you, you dont know the answer becuase you never even bothered to even try to understand. it seems like faith was put here to throw you off your own path .... and ur so weak minded that it works everytime LOL ..

by your own definition .... you're going to hell ... im just tryin to help u out LOL

Powerful post....

 

[whar67]

It not about the miraculous outcomes. God could just give us that reality where we are introduced to the facts and God is present (though Jesus is said to be God Incarnate). The world won't choose God regardless...not willingly. Who are we to say that the Israelite's "wandering" is punishment if God exists. It sure reads that way but who are we to determine that?

Vast majority of the planet has chosen God, maybe not your brand of religion but some version. And atheist would probably return to this fold as well if reality and the God question did not appear impossible together. As for 'determining' thing we are the only sentient rational being walking around. Determining things is our job.

 

[PapaJuice]

without free will you would be a robot

and lucifer is the yin to the yang

the world is run and ran by two opposing sides, yin & yang

by the way, if u spell "God", add a O and it's Good

If you spell "Devil", take out the D and it's Evil

 

[sounds of jacob]

Hmm. So American Blacks are considered differerent and there are like 4 different groups of what is considered Native Americans? (Aztek, Inca, seminole) ect.? I do not get it. And how are Mexicans considered Aztecs but no considered Spanish? Also how are Haitians differant from dominicans. I mean its like 4 blocks away? Most of them come from the same place. Not to mention Puerto Ricans and Cubans.

This is not even logical.

HERE IS THE TRUE UNDERSTANDING , INDERSTANDING , OVERSTANDING

PEACE YAH BLESS