"I Fear I May Have Integrated My People Into a Burning House" - Martin Luther King Jr.

[The Lonious Monk]

I understand your point

My point was about how long do we as an nation continue to live in that legacy. Just image the millions upon millions of your fellow Americans who didn't have anything to do with those times....how much longer should the guilt trip be laid at the feet of people who were never ever involved in that legacy? Why do so many non-whites hold those on the periphery of this issue responsible? why!? It never ends it just goes on and on and on and on and on.

Watch that when you get a chance. It's not all about blaming every single American for the shit that has happened in the past. The probably is the country is built on principles that allow for some people (the white elite) to push a way of being that continue to disenfranchise people (mostly minorities). The problem is that this refusal to acknowledge what's being done is a problem and makes it difficult for any kind of wholesale progress to be made.

 

[white715]

@white715

I hear what you're saying. But I don't understand why the agenda would be for we the people to become the firemen and put out a fire to a house/system that is designed to exploit and destroy us/the people. And to be outside of the house, realize it's on fire, and continue to walk in, while leading others into that very house makes no sense to me.

Why would MLK say "I've come across something that deeply disturbs me"... if he believed he was still doing the right thing. He had a moment of clarity and realized that we were about to get everything he had been fighting so passionately for, only to become the very thing (mentally) he was fighting against. If you want to be a guest in anyone's house, you must play their game or become like those who live in the house.

I like the idea of The Poor Peoples Campaign for economic justice. I support all forms of true justice. But justice will NEVER be executed through asking (your oppressors of all people), or marching. True justice requires revolution. Houses (systems) need to be allowed to be completely burned down. Foundations (mentalities) need to be uprooted. New foundations need to be laid. And new and better homes need to be built.

THE HOUSE!

THE HOUSE!

THE HOUSE IS ON FIRE!!!...

The only other options would've been to go back to Africa or continuing on with Jim Crow.

And SMH at people blaming integration for the current state of Black America, integration was supposed to be the 1st step, but after Martin died and the Panthers neutralized no one was left to futher the cause and gangs, jobs left the communities, and crack was pushed into the inner city.

But to blame integration is like a WR catching the ball running 5 yards then fumbling and blaming the snap.

 

[GSonII]

Oh, and just to be clear, I'm not saying/suggesting that MLK was saying the problem was/is integration. I'm saying he realized that integrating into a crooked system was/is the the problem.

I think MLK was trying to save the propagated "idea" of this country, by saying "I'm afraid that America may be losing what moral vision she may have had,..." When there was never any true morality in this country to begin with. As we all know, this country was built off bloodshed, deceit, slavery, and exploitation.

How can there ever be economic justice in a system that needs there to be a "lower class" in order for there to be an "upper class"?

When did our society decide it owes everyone a decent existence....whatever happened to personal gumption and initiative? America is descending into a nation of takers who don't wanna work. People continue to wallow and wallow in self pity. America is no longer the home of the brave.

The America you speak of never existed. This country has always been a nation of takers who don't want to work. This land was taken from the Natives and built on the backs of slaves. It's not about self pity, it's about justice.

And as human beings, it's our duty to help others experience a decent existence.

NO!!! this nation wasn't built on that premise IE take from others and don't ever contribute. Are U implying/claiming that blacks single handedly built this country? STOP with this nonsense about justice for all and we owe others a decent living/existence....how 'bout personal gumption and getting off ones lazy ass....this nation wasn't built on the back of lazy peoples.....I see homeless people everyday of my life and they aren't starving and, there's literally hundreds of organizations feeding and clothing them....wallow in self-pity and you'll never have 2 work a day in your life.

What did the US give the Native Americans for all the land and resources they took? Not a damn thing. They invoked Manifest Destiny, and claimed it was their divine right to take everything. What did the US give the slaves for all their hard work? Not a damn thing.

I'm not saying that people shouldn't work to live. Of course they should, but let's not act like a lot of people in power haven't shaped law and the country as a whole so that they could make max money off of minimal effort. That's what slavery was about. Rich plantation owners wanted to get richer and they didn't want to do the work or pay for the workers so they force people to do it virtually for free and that was sanctioned by this country for decades.

I understand your point

My point was about how long do we as an nation continue to live in that legacy. Just image the millions upon millions of your fellow Americans who didn't have anything to do with those times....how much longer should the guilt trip be laid at the feet of people who were never ever involved in that legacy? Why do so many non-whites hold those on the periphery of this issue responsible? why!? It never ends it just goes on and on and on and on and on.

Not much longer as a black man I know that America will never change to my liking. Africa may not be the place to go but there are options of other countries to live

 

[The Lonious Monk]

When did I ignore current progress. I've gone on record as saying that I think it's stupid when people act like racism is the same now as it always is. That said, just because things have gotten better doesn't mean they are perfect. And just because you acknowledge improvements doesn't mean you shouldn't also point out remaining inequities. And your "some black people have done it so every black person should be able to do it" is the same dumb rhetoric every racist uses to criticize the plight of blacks. Some blacks managed to become rich during slave days. Does that mean it was just as easy for all blacks to do it? During Reconstruction, a lot of blacks climbed up their station. Some even attained government offices. Does that mean that American society was suddenly fair towards blacks? No, that line of reasoning is dumb when applied to those times and it's dumb when applied to now.

Past that, I'm not sure what your silly little rant even means. Who is even saying that we should help a bunch of people who aren't willing to help themselves? Taking care of people who are in unfortunate positions and assuring that everyone has some reasonable base standard of living is no the same as promising someone a rose garden. That's the whole reason we have governments and civilized societies. You give up some of your rights and adhere to a set of laws created by a governing body with the agreement that the governing body will assure certain things for you. No, that doesn't mean that people who just want to sit on their asses should be handed riches, but it does mean that if you live in the nation, are willing to abide by the rules, and will work as necessary to assure a good life that the nation should put some effort into assuring that as a possibility.

 

[janklow]

What did the US give the Native Americans for all the land and resources they took?

clearly SOMEONE is forgetting all those sweet casinos

 

[The Lonious Monk]

Yeah the Casinos that somehow didn't stop Native Reservations from being basically 3rd world nations within a nation.

 

[white715]

 

[kzzl]

I always assumed MLK's last minute realization was a slight over sight on his part. Dude was so busying fighting for civil rights that he might have over looked how much damage the "burning house" was in. Not noticing it till it was too late. Dude didn't regret what he did and it sounded like he still believed what he did was right.

He just realized the problem was bigger than he thought. He still believed it was worth fighting for and that his people wouldn't be destroyed by it. Not really a change in his way of thinking.

The quote from X did make me chuckle at MLK's comment, though. Dude made a clever point, as he usually did back then. All I can say is that if the shoe fits, wear it.

 

[zombie]

I can't believe that people think that the loss of a whole fucking hemisphere can be equalized by the granting of permits to buid casinos. Anyway the past is the past and we should move forward and build a brighter future but the MLK LETS all be american and learn to love white people

way of doing things has run it's course we have got all we can get out of it and we need to try new things like only loving ourselves and our race. Put the interest of the black race first not america we should turn inward and build ourselves only using america as a tool to do that.

 

[Say What]

Malcolm moved away from a lot of the things he said earlier in his career. At the time of his death he was more inclined to hear argument of integration.

I think Martin always believed his cause but he saw it couldn't be fought with one front.

 

[zombie]

Malcolm moved away from a lot of the things he said earlier in his career. At the time of his death he was more inclined to hear argument of integration.

I think Martin always believed his cause but he saw it couldn't be fought with one front.

The bolded is not true.

 

[Swiffness!]

Integration was a terrible idea smh

We shoulda went with Black Nationalism and became self sufficient and support ourselves

Niggas ain't ready for that. Too much sacrifice, hard work, and bloodshed. Easier to chill and watch ESPN.

When they finally try to round us up into camps and mass graves, Nazi style, then maybe we'll learn.

 

[Say What]

Malcolm moved away from a lot of the things he said earlier in his career. At the time of his death he was more inclined to hear argument of integration.

I think Martin always believed his cause but he saw it couldn't be fought with one front.

The bolded is not true.

He shifted to more working with everyone. After he converted he had more of an world view but if you choose to deny that be my guess.

 

[zombie]

Malcolm moved away from a lot of the things he said earlier in his career. At the time of his death he was more inclined to hear argument of integration.

I think Martin always believed his cause but he saw it couldn't be fought with one front.

The bolded is not true.

He shifted to more working with everyone. After he converted he had more of an world view but if you choose to deny that be my guess.

Working with different kinds of people does not mean he stood for integration but After people die we tend to twust their words. Malcolm x wanting to work toward integration is a lie he did not believe it could work

 

[Say What]

Malcolm moved away from a lot of the things he said earlier in his career. At the time of his death he was more inclined to hear argument of integration.

I think Martin always believed his cause but he saw it couldn't be fought with one front.

The bolded is not true.

He shifted to more working with everyone. After he converted he had more of an world view but if you choose to deny that be my guess.

Working with different kinds of people does not mean he stood for integration but After people die we tend to twust their words. Malcolm x wanting to work toward integration is a lie he did not believe it could work

I just said he was more inclined to listen. I also read it in 2 books about him that basically saying the something on Wiki ...

Although he no longer called for the separation of black people from white people, Malcolm X continued to advocate black nationalism, which he defined as self-determination for the African-American community.[228] In the last months of his life, however, Malcolm X began to reconsider his support of black nationalism after meeting northern African revolutionaries who, to all appearances, were white

 

[white715]

Sadly now Black peoples biggest threat are niggas, so we have no choice but to look inward.

 

[janklow]

Yeah the Casinos that somehow didn't stop Native Reservations from being basically 3rd world nations within a nation.

i am pretty sure if you took that post seriously, you're doing this whole internet thing wrong

Malcolm moved away from a lot of the things he said earlier in his career. At the time of his death he was more inclined to hear argument of integration.

I think Martin always believed his cause but he saw it couldn't be fought with one front.

The bolded is not true.

in turn, you're kind of overstating this because of the position you want to believe, especially since he split hairs and used the phrase "more inclined to hear"

Malcolm progressed from what he was when he was first into the NOI; where he would have gone, honestly, how could we know

 

[The Lonious Monk]

i am pretty sure if you took that post seriously, you're doing this whole internet thing wrong

Nah, I knew you weren't serious. That said I responded anyway. Why you ask, because at least one person on here thinks like this:

Yeah the Casinos that somehow didn't stop Native Reservations from being basically 3rd world nations within a nation.

Just who turned those entities into that third world status? -- I guess our nation will be indebted forever and ever? I guess our nation will also be indebted to every new generation of black people who wallow in a legacy they never lived?? it never seems to end. The blame and victim game is a big business & its supporters are powerful.

In other words, there are people on here who will actually argue that the Casinos were a great gift and squared the debt the US owes to the Natives.

On a side note, is that Hey Slick? I thought that dude was dead.

 

[zombie]

Yeah the Casinos that somehow didn't stop Native Reservations from being basically 3rd world nations within a nation.

i am pretty sure if you took that post seriously, you're doing this whole internet thing wrong

Malcolm moved away from a lot of the things he said earlier in his career. At the time of his death he was more inclined to hear argument of integration.

I think Martin always believed his cause but he saw it couldn't be fought with one front.

The bolded is not true.

in turn, you're kind of overstating this because of the position you want to believe, especially since he split hairs and used the phrase "more inclined to hear"

Malcolm progressed from what he was when he was first into the NOI; where he would have gone, honestly, how could we know

He never progressed toward integration being open to hearing all alternative solutions does not equal acceptance of them.

 

[NeighborhoodNomad.]

I understand your point

My point was about how long do we as an nation continue to live in that legacy. Just image the millions upon millions of your fellow Americans who didn't have anything to do with those times....how much longer should the guilt trip be laid at the feet of people who were never ever involved in that legacy? Why do so many non-whites hold those on the periphery of this issue responsible? why!? It never ends it just goes on and on and on and on and on.

Watch that when you get a chance. It's not all about blaming every single American for the shit that has happened in the past. The probably is the country is built on principles that allow for some people (the white elite) to push a way of being that continue to disenfranchise people (mostly minorities). The problem is that this refusal to acknowledge what's being done is a problem and makes it difficult for any kind of wholesale progress to be made.

This video is very much on point. "White Privilege" should be a mandatory curriculum in every high school and college across the planet. I especially love how he closes out his lecture with the debt analogy. It's all about accountability. Human beings hate accountability, but it's the first step in true progress.