Couple of christianity questions

[fiat_money]

I'm an atheist, who never prayed for myself even when I was a Christian, and I always get what I want. Usually through some form of manipulation or by excelling in an area.

So, if I did pray for myself and got the same outcome, it wouldn't be because prayer "works", but because of the actions I took.

There was a fat chick in a wheelchair at the church I attended in my younger days, they "healed" her about once every six months or so.

She's still in the wheelchair, plus she developed cancer and diabetes last time I checked.

^^They constantly prayed for her as well, and she constantly deteriorates.

People only say prayer "works" after observing a situation have what they consider to be "good" outcome; when the situation had an initially undetermined outcome. An example would be of someone who is diagnosed with some form of cancer, who prays and returns to their pre-cancer state; people would say that the prayer is what helped them. This example follows the model, the outcome of the person's cancer was undetermined, and that person returned to their pre-cancer state; an outcome the observer consider considers "good". This is possible because there was a chance that the individual could recover from the cancer. However, if the situation had a determined outcome, the case would be different. Such as a person losing a leg in a car accident, even if they pray to regrow their leg, it will not happen, since humans can't regenerate limbs in such a manner. This situation's outcome is already determined, and there is no chance of the leg regrowing on its own; so people will either not expect prayer to work on it, or they won't pray for the leg to regrow.

If prayer truly worked, it'd change the outcome of of a situation with determined outcome to the desired outcome of whoever was praying; instead of merely being limited situations that already have a chance of having outcome that those praying will consider "good".

Saying prayer "works" is like saying someone can predict the future for guessing the correct number they'll roll on some dice.

 

[notme]

FAITH is just a euphemism for IGNORANCE

And since you can't prove that GOD does NOT exist, you rely on that same FAITH as well to perpetuate your BELIEFS

 

[Legend24]

If prayer truly worked, it'd change the outcome of of a situation with determined outcome to the desired outcome of whoever was praying; instead of merely being limited situations that already have a chance of having outcome that those praying will consider "good".

Saying prayer "works" is like saying someone can predict the future for guessing the correct number they'll roll on some dice.

I don't claim to know whether there is or is not a god but I have observed some things from back in my "religious" days.

When you pray and it works, "god is good". When you pray and you are not answered, "it is not meant to be".

The thing about true faith is that it's unwavering... no matter how bad people get ethered, they still believe.

 

[judahxulu]

How you gone ask a question like that?

What kind of prayer? What kind of content?

What are supposed to be the effects to know if it "works" or not?

I know the old "ask for anything in the name of Jesus" piece don't work. And according to what I've seen in the Bible and its source material when people prayed they asked for skill and understanding or something else internal to produce an external effect.

 

[judahxulu]

Faith is not ignorance nor is it a noun...its an active process.

Lexicon Results

Strong's H539 - 'aman

אָמַן

Transliteration

'aman



Pronunciation

ä·man' (Key)

Part of Speech

verb



Root Word (Etymology)

A primitive root

TWOT Reference

116

Outline of Biblical Usage

1) to support, confirm, be faithful

a) (Qal)

1) to support, confirm, be faithful, uphold, nourish

a) foster-father (subst.)

b) foster-mother, nurse

c) pillars, supporters of the door

b) (Niphal)

1) to be established, be faithful, be carried, make firm

a) to be carried by a nurse

b) made firm, sure, lasting

c) confirmed, established, sure

d) verified, confirmed

e) reliable, faithful, trusty

c) (Hiphil)

1) to stand firm, to trust, to be certain, to believe in

a) stand firm

b) trust, believe

 

[KTULU IS BACK]

faith, in the context of religion or spirituality, means believing without evidence or despite evidence to the contrary

 

[DoUwant2go2Heaven]

faith, in the context of religion or spirituality, means believing without evidence or despite evidence to the contrary

Nah brah.....

"Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen." Hebrews 11:1

God is invisible but I know (faith) that He exists. Why? Because He has made Himself real to me. I have evidence of what can't be seen. I know God is real and I know that what I have placed my hope in will come to pass. I know with all my mind, body, soul, heart, and spirit that I will live forever with God. How bout you?

"25For I know that my redeemer liveth, and that he shall stand at the latter day upon the earth: 26And though after my skin worms destroy this body, yet in my flesh shall I see God:
27Whom I shall see for myself, and mine eyes shall behold, and not another; though my reins be consumed within me."

Job 19:25-27

 

[judahxulu]

faith, in the context of religion or spirituality, means believing without evidence or despite evidence to the contrary

Whats up, my nigga??

Pleasantries aside..thats only one facet or interpretation of faith according to Webster's Dictionary

Main Entry: 1faith
Pronunciation: \ˈfāth\
Function: noun
Inflected Form(s): plural faiths \ˈfāths, sometimes ˈfāthz\
Etymology: Middle English feith, from Anglo-French feid, fei, from Latin fides; akin to Latin fidere to trust — more at bide
Date: 13th century

1 a : allegiance to duty or a person : loyalty b (1) : fidelity to one's promises (2) : sincerity of intentions
2 a (1) : belief and trust in and loyalty to God (2) : belief in the traditional doctrines of a religion b (1) : firm belief in something for which there is no proof (2) : complete trust
3 : something that is believed especially with strong conviction; especially : a system of religious beliefs
synonyms see belief

— on faith : without question

In English, it is apparently a noun. Interesting stuff.

 

[KTULU IS BACK]

Nah brah.....

"Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen." Hebrews 11:1

thats pretty much the exact same thing i said, dun

 

[KTULU IS BACK]

Whats up, my nigga??

Pleasantries aside..thats only one facet or interpretation of faith according to Webster's Dictionary

how are ya?

dictionary's track how people are currently using language. they're not the end all be all source for what words mean. i think we can agree that the word faith has different meanings in different contexts, and in the case of religion, faith is about electing to hold to a metaphysical conclusion whether or not its supported by available premises and evidences

 

[judahxulu]

how are ya?

dictionary's track how people are currently using language. they're not the end all be all source for what words mean. i think we can agree that the word faith has different meanings in different contexts, and in the case of religion, faith is about electing to hold to a metaphysical conclusion whether or not its supported by available premises and evidences

I am robust and in good health, kind sir.Thank you for asking. I think you summed up that religious faith thing succinctly.

 

[TX_Made713]

now things are about to get interesting

 

[judahxulu]

now things are about to get interesting

Good. This one-trick pony, fake ass black power shit that dominates around here is getting boring. We needs a bit of shaking up in this piece.

 

[usmarin3]

And since you can't prove that GOD does NOT exist, you rely on that same FAITH as well to perpetuate your BELIEFS

LOL the burden of proof is on you to prove that he exist, none of us has even seen god so my convictions stands up more than yours. You only think you know that a god exists

 

[judahxulu]

LOL the burden of proof is on you to prove that he exist, none of us has even seen god so my convictions stands up more than yours. You only think you know that a god exists

You cant see air neither.Prove or disprove its existence. Make the debate more interesting than that dude.

 

[usmarin3]

You cant see air neither.Prove or disprove its existence. Make the debate more interesting than that dude.

I can feel air, i don't feel god.

 

[BiblicalAtheist]

I can feel air, i don't feel god.

But can you taste, smell, hear, see or touch consciousness?

 

[usmarin3]

But can you taste, smell, hear, see or touch consciousness?

I live consciousness, the mere fact that i think about the plight of the less fortunate and people who suffer, shows that i am conscious. To have compassion is to be conscious!

 

[BiblicalAtheist]

I live consciousness, the mere fact that i think about the plight of the less fortunate and people who suffer, shows that i am conscious. To have compassion is to be conscious!

Where is your consciousness?

 

[usmarin3]

Where is your consciousness?

Just being aware, looking beyond the bullshit of everyday life. Seeing it's more to life than material possession, hoes, self indulgence,etc.