Was God a Volcano? Moses makes him seem that way!

[VIBE]

Is this guy trying to pull something? He reads this verse:

Deu 4:12

And the Lord spake unto you out of the midst of the fire: ye heard the voice of the words, but saw no similitude; only [ye heard] a voice.

But, he reads it as: you heard NO words. He is saying that Moses heard NO words, seen no FORM but heard a voice? That sounds stupid. Then I look it up, of course it says he DID hear the VOICE OF THE WORDS. Every version says so. So either he's purposely saying that or he just misread somehow.

Also, how would you explain everything that Moses spoke about? The Commandments were made up? How was he able to be in such intense heat? How wasn't he choking to death, how did he see, breathe?

I'll wait for a proper answer.

 

[ThaChozenWun]

Is this guy trying to pull something? He reads this verse:

Deu 4:12

And the Lord spake unto you out of the midst of the fire: ye heard the voice of the words, but saw no similitude; only [ye heard] a voice.

But, he reads it as: you heard NO words. He is saying that Moses heard NO words, seen no FORM but heard a voice? That sounds stupid. Then I look it up, of course it says he DID hear the VOICE OF THE WORDS. Every version says so. So either he's purposely saying that or he just misread somehow.

Also, how would you explain everything that Moses spoke about? The Commandments were made up? How was he able to be in such intense heat? How wasn't he choking to death, how did he see, breathe?

I'll wait for a proper answer.

You can breathe and see through volcanic ash. It will fuck your lungs up, but people go through volcanic ash, smoke, and look down into volcanoes all the time. It isn't like if you stand 10 feet away from volcanic magma you burn up. Perhaps you should have just looked it up.

And no he heard no words. He heard a voice but no words. Different bibles have it worded differently. The hebrew bible also says he heard a voice but seen nor heard no similitude. Which means he heard a voice but the words were not the ones he spoke, which is likely just the mountain rumbling taken as god talking. Watch it again and listen how he reads it and then what he says after he reads it.

Because Moses said it happened it absolutely had to? Why don't you take other books as serious, same time, same people, what makes the bible different. As a matter of fact, the Quran actually makes more claims that turn out to be scientifically correct and prophesizes a lot more things that have happened.

The 10 commandments were made before the bible.

 

[VIBE]

You can breathe and see through volcanic ash. It will fuck your lungs up, but people go through volcanic ash, smoke, and look down into volcanoes all the time. It isn't like if you stand 10 feet away from volcanic magma you burn up. Perhaps you should have just looked it up.

And no he heard no words. He heard a voice but no words. Different bibles have it worded differently. The hebrew bible also says he heard a voice but seen nor heard no similitude. Which means he heard a voice but the words were not the ones he spoke, which is likely just the mountain rumbling taken as god talking. Watch it again and listen how he reads it and then what he says after he reads it.

Because Moses said it happened it absolutely had to? Why don't you take other books as serious, same time, same people, what makes the bible different. As a matter of fact, the Quran actually makes more claims that turn out to be scientifically correct and prophesizes a lot more things that have happened.

The 10 commandments were made before the bible.

Really? So I can walk through volcanic clouds without it hurting my eyes or having effects on me? You do know that as it's erupting it's not a cool feeling, it's heat right? You see eruptions and people that are close, which I've never seen, are wearing suits. Right? Yeah, they do. They aren't protected by little rivers of lava, which they say is still very very very hot and only okay for a few seconds. Also, there was never a mention of ash. Clouds yes, dark clouds yes. No ash. Now they know what ash is because in Exodus it speaks of the animal sacrifice and about the ashes of the sacrifice so they knew what it was. Why no mention there though?

Yes, the Commandments were made before the bible, it was later written.

So you imply Moses was tripping out? It says there was no form. But it does say he "heard a voice of the words" it doesn't say he DIDN'T hear words. If he didn't hear words then why does he speak back the words God said then? He thinks the rumbling of the volcano was speaking so he just interprets it?

You're right, people look down volcanoes all the time. But funny not while it's erupting. So would you go to Hawaii and look down a volcano that's erupting? No, I think not. I've seen shows on lava dude, this mess isn't Dante's Peak or Volcano.

It doesn't matter how he says it AFTER, the FACT is he didn't read it RIGHT AT ALL. You say, "different bibles, different versions" actually LOOK IT UP YOURSELF. What HE SAYS it doesn't say that, he PUT that in there.

 

[kids in america_]

This is very Jordan Maxwell-ish.

 

[ThaChozenWun]

Really? So I can walk through volcanic clouds without it hurting my eyes or having effects on me? You do know that as it's erupting it's not a cool feeling, it's heat right? You see eruptions and people that are close, which I've never seen, are wearing suits. Right? Yeah, they do. They aren't protected by little rivers of lava, which they say is still very very very hot and only okay for a few seconds. Also, there was never a mention of ash. Clouds yes, dark clouds yes. No ash. Now they know what ash is because in Exodus it speaks of the animal sacrifice and about the ashes of the sacrifice so they knew what it was. Why no mention there though?

Yup, and he wasn't at the edge looking it while it was erupting. He was at the top of the mountain not at the ring of fire. No they aren't always wearing suits only those testing and taking samples of things. Yes Lava is hot, but it doesn't emit massive heat where you burn unless you on the other side of planet. You can stand within 7-8 feet of flowing lava and not get burned. Clouds and Ash are the same thing in the context of time, both filled the air with a gray cloud. They knew what ashes were from cooking bodies and playing with man made fire, they did not know how volcanoes worked at that time, go search it smarty.

Yes, the Commandments were made before the bible, it was later written.

Yea....... Moses wasn't given the 10 commandments he made them.

So you imply Moses was tripping out? It says there was no form. But it does say he "heard a voice of the words" it doesn't say he DIDN'T hear words. If he didn't hear words then why does he speak back the words God said then? He thinks the rumbling of the volcano was speaking so he just interprets it? [/quotes]
read the hebrew bible in hebrew it does say he heard a voice but no words. Again your new age christian influenced bible has a lot of shit wrong in it.

You're right, people look down volcanoes all the time. But funny not while it's erupting. So would you go to Hawaii and look down a volcano that's erupting? No, I think not. I've seen shows on lava dude, this mess isn't Dante's Peak or Volcano.

He was AT THE TOP OF THE MOUNTAIN, NOT AT THE RING OF FIRE.

It doesn't matter how he says it AFTER, the FACT is he didn't read it RIGHT AT ALL. You say, "different bibles, different versions" actually LOOK IT UP YOURSELF. What HE SAYS it doesn't say that, he PUT that in there.

Lol No he didn't. Come on son, research before you say shit.

 

[VIBE]

Lol No he didn't. Come on son, research before you say shit.

I did and that's how I actually READ from online bibles and mine at home that it doesn't say what he said. Listen to what HE SAID. Seriously, then read a verse and tell me did it really say what he said?

 

[ThaChozenWun]

I did and that's how I actually READ from online bibles and mine at home that it doesn't say what he said. Listen to what HE SAID. Seriously, then read a verse and tell me did it really say what he said?

Do you not get it!

No Similitude. That means he heard no words similar to his and he saw no form similar to his. THAT MEANS HE DID HE HEARD A VOICE BUT NO SIMILAR WORDS. Come on man seriously.

 

[judahxulu]

You can breathe and see through volcanic ash. It will fuck your lungs up, but people go through volcanic ash, smoke, and look down into volcanoes all the time. It isn't like if you stand 10 feet away from volcanic magma you burn up. Perhaps you should have just looked it up.

And no he heard no words. He heard a voice but no words. Different bibles have it worded differently. The hebrew bible also says he heard a voice but seen nor heard no similitude. Which means he heard a voice but the words were not the ones he spoke, which is likely just the mountain rumbling taken as god talking. Watch it again and listen how he reads it and then what he says after he reads it.

Because Moses said it happened it absolutely had to? Why don't you take other books as serious, same time, same people, what makes the bible different. As a matter of fact, the Quran actually makes more claims that turn out to be scientifically correct and prophesizes a lot more things that have happened.

The 10 commandments were made before the bible.

Maybe but he came down with 613 laws, ordinances, statutes and judgements not 10 commandments.

 

[judahxulu]

Maybe but he came down with 613 laws, ordinances, statutes and judgements not 10 commandments.

Then again scratch that MAYBE until you produce a document that predates the Mosaic Law in which making images of the deity is forbidden in conjunction with the other 612 laws.

 

[ThaChozenWun]

Maybe but he came down with 613 laws, ordinances, statutes and judgements not 10 commandments.

The 10 commandments were made before Moses' trip. Once he came down with the 613 they were re-done. 6 of the 10 commandments were made laws by the Sumerians. After he came down with the 613 there were an extra 4 added.

 

[ThaChozenWun]

The 10 commandments were made before Moses' trip. Once he came down with the 613 they were re-done. 6 of the 10 commandments were made laws by the Sumerians. After he came down with the 613 there were an extra 4 added.

Let me fix that to make it more clear. 6 of the modern 10 commandments were original laws in Sumerian law. Once Mose's came down with 613 laws and such it was extended to anywhere between 15-30 commandments. Once Constantine sorted everything out with his group, they determined only 10 were sufficient. They kept the 6 original Sumerian laws and added only 4 of Mose's.

 

[Skeratch]

Let me fix that to make it more clear. 6 of the modern 10 commandments were original laws in Sumerian law. Once Mose's came down with 613 laws and such it was extended to anywhere between 15-30 commandments. Once Constantine sorted everything out with his group, they determined only 10 were sufficient. They kept the 6 original Sumerian laws and added only 4 of Mose's.

Don't really care if anyone thinks God is a volcano, but the Torah is a little older than Constantine the Great.

 

[ThaChozenWun]

Don't really care if anyone thinks God is a volcano, but the Torah is a little older than Constantine the Great.

And correct me if I'm wrong but the Torah doesn't list only 10. It has all 613 in it

248 Positive
365 Negative

 

[judahxulu]

The 10 commandments were made before Moses' trip. Once he came down with the 613 they were re-done. 6 of the 10 commandments were made laws by the Sumerians. After he came down with the 613 there were an extra 4 added.

sorry my friend...first of all the Sumerians didnt make any laws technically. They adapted many aspects of pre-existing Akkadian culture. Hammurabi was Semitic; not Sumerian. secondly the only thing remotely close to this is the Shurpu text, Tablet 2 of the Akkadian incantation texts not laws. And the connection is spurious as the Akkadians were polytheistic and did not believe in a personal relationship between their chief god Anu or even those in the hierarchy of gods with man. Interestingly enough, this tablet has more in common with the Negative Confessions of Ma'at than they do with Mosaic law. Only thing they are older than Kemet as the clay tablets found in the library of King Ashurbanipal (7th century BCE) were copies of materials written between the 12th and 15th centuries B.C.E ...Now I can see certain codes having parallels with babylonian texts in all honesty because a.) proximity b.) Abraham was from babylon and c.) similar social/cultural problems to be addressed. But such is not the case in Mosaic law because there is no law that predates it that deals with purification rites in such a concise and medically sound manner.

Its funny you brought up the Sumerians though..I copped this book called "Religions of the Ancient Near East: Sumero-Akkadian Religious Texts and Ugaritic Epics" from the goodwill for 50 cents and been buried in it all weekend. This book is the bomb yo..from what you post it seems like it might interest you. Maybe Amazon got it..IDK.

But step ya clay tablet game up mayne...LOL

 

[ThaChozenWun]

sorry my friend...first of all the Sumerians didnt make any laws technically. They adapted many aspects of pre-existing Akkadian culture. Hammurabi was Semitic; not Sumerian. secondly the only thing remotely close to this is the Shurpu text, Tablet 2 of the Akkadian incantation texts not laws. And the connection is spurious as the Akkadians were polytheistic and did not believe in a personal relationship between their chief god Anu or even those in the hierarchy of gods with man. Interestingly enough, this tablet has more in common with the Negative Confessions of Ma'at than they do with Mosaic law. Only thing they are older than Kemet as the clay tablets found in the library of King Ashurbanipal (7th century BCE) were copies of materials written between the 12th and 15th centuries B.C.E ...Now I can see certain codes having parallels with babylonian texts in all honesty because a.) proximity b.) Abraham was from babylon and c.) similar social/cultural problems to be addressed. But such is not the case in Mosaic law because there is no law that predates it that deals with purification rites in such a concise and medically sound manner.

Its funny you brought up the Sumerians though..I copped this book called "Religions of the Ancient Near East: Sumero-Akkadian Religious Texts and Ugaritic Epics" from the goodwill for 50 cents and been buried in it all weekend. This book is the bomb yo..from what you post it seems like it might interest you. Maybe Amazon got it..IDK.

But step ya clay tablet game up mayne...LOL

http://iraq.iraq.ir/history/sumerianlaws.htm
6 of the 10 commandments were products of Sumerian Law.

Maybe our thought of what a law is differs so that's were a misunderstanding comes from. They weren't the first to say "Dont kill" etc.. but they were the first to write them down.

As for the book never heard of it. I'll go get it though once I find it, Sumerians were the first real civilized people in terms of cities and working together as a large group of people.

 

[Skeratch]

And correct me if I'm wrong but the Torah doesn't list only 10. It has all 613 in it

248 Positive

365 Negative

The ten commandments were recognized as the foundation for the rest of the commandments and have always been recognized as special and separate from the other laws.

I'm not sure Mt. Sinai could have been volcanically active at the time when Moses was supposedly alive, or how does that fit?

 

[ThaChozenWun]

The ten commandments were recognized as the foundation for the rest of the commandments and have always been recognized as special and separate from the other laws.

I'm not sure Mt. Sinai could have been volcanically active at the time when Moses was supposedly alive, or how does that fit?

Yea because the commandments came before everything else like I said earlier.

As for Mt. Sinai. It was supposedly active between 1350-1275BC. Not sure exactly what time period that Moses was supposed to exist, but when I read the original article on it and did a little searching the activity of Mt. Sinai was present during the 1300 BC area.

As for the whole story though I really could care less about it. To me Moses and everyone else are nothing more than symbolic characters in ancient stories that were later mistaken as being true stories.

 

[VIBE]

Deu 4:12

And the Lord spake unto you out of the midst of the fire: ye heard the voice of the words, but saw no similitude; only [ye heard] a voice.

SAW no similitude which would = SAW NO FORM. SAW, can you SEE words when someone speaks? No, you cannot. Argue with me, go ahead, really. The verse is VERY CLEAR. SAW NO FORM bro, not SAW NO WORDS lol you cannot SEE words being SPOKEN. He only HEARD a voice now that doesn't mean he didn't hear words, because it says, "YE HEARD THE VOICE OF THE WORDS" now if he didn't hear the words, why would it say he heard the voice of the words? Also, why would he come down with words from God Himself? KJV is uses, "similitude" others use FORM in place of similitude. So where do you get he didn't hear words? Please, SHOW ME. Any other versions don't state what he did.

Here, I'll make it easier for you. Verse above is from KJV. I'll post ones from the different versions.

ASV:

deut 4:12

And Jehovah spake unto you out of the midst of the fire: ye heard the voice of words, but ye saw no form; only (ye heard) a voice.

YLT:

deut 4:12

'And Jehovah speaketh unto you out of the midst of the fire; a voice of words ye are hearing and a similitude ye are not seeing, only a voice;

RSV:

deut 4:12

Then the Lord spoke to you out of the midst of the fire; you heard the sound of words, but saw no form; there was only a voice.

NAS:

deut 4:12

"Then the LORD spoke to you from the midst of the fire; you heard the sound of words, but you saw no form-- only a voice.

So you tell me, where does it say NO WORDS were heard? Please dude, seriously. What he stated is a VERY BIG deal because he is either misreading or purposely putting in words that aren't there. He's misleading his viewers.

 

[ThaChozenWun]

Deu 4:12

And the Lord spake unto you out of the midst of the fire: ye heard the voice of the words, but saw no similitude; only [ye heard] a voice.

SAW no similitude which would = SAW NO FORM. SAW, can you SEE words when someone speaks? No, you cannot. Argue with me, go ahead, really. The verse is VERY CLEAR. SAW NO FORM bro, not SAW NO WORDS lol you cannot SEE words being SPOKEN. He only HEARD a voice now that doesn't mean he didn't hear words, because it says, "YE HEARD THE VOICE OF THE WORDS" now if he didn't hear the words, why would it say he heard the voice of the words? Also, why would he come down with words from God Himself? KJV is uses, "similitude" others use FORM in place of similitude. So where do you get he didn't hear words? Please, SHOW ME. Any other versions don't state what he did.

Here, I'll make it easier for you. Verse above is from KJV. I'll post ones from the different versions.

ASV:

deut 4:12

And Jehovah spake unto you out of the midst of the fire: ye heard the voice of words, but ye saw no form; only (ye heard) a voice.

YLT:

deut 4:12

'And Jehovah speaketh unto you out of the midst of the fire; a voice of words ye are hearing and a similitude ye are not seeing, only a voice;

RSV:

deut 4:12

Then the Lord spoke to you out of the midst of the fire; you heard the sound of words, but saw no form; there was only a voice.

NAS:

deut 4:12

"Then the LORD spoke to you from the midst of the fire; you heard the sound of words, but you saw no form-- only a voice.

So you tell me, where does it say NO WORDS were heard? Please dude, seriously. What he stated is a VERY BIG deal because he is either misreading or purposely putting in words that aren't there. He's misleading his viewers.

No similitude
Only a voice

Neither words nor form were similar to his, meaning he saw nothing, and he only heard a sound but no real words

 

[Skeratch]

Yea because the commandments came before everything else like I said earlier.

As for Mt. Sinai. It was supposedly active between 1350-1275BC. Not sure exactly what time period that Moses was supposed to exist, but when I read the original article on it and did a little searching the activity of Mt. Sinai was present during the 1300 BC area.

As for the whole story though I really could care less about it. To me Moses and everyone else are nothing more than symbolic characters in ancient stories that were later mistaken as being true stories.

There are corroborations between the way ancient Mesopotamian laws and contracts were drawn up and the way the Hebrew law was drawn up, but the monotheistic approach was unique for its time.

It's an interesting theory, I got to say.