Video: “People Died Because Of That Word” – College Students Call Old Man A ‘N*gga’ While He Buys B

[blacktux]

Regarding your question with the "apple". I would say no.

But it is not a comparable analogy unless black people are calling themselves apples with pride knowing the negative way the word relates to their peoples past.

Like I said in the analogy, blacks wouldn't call themselves apples because as a slur it denotes being hanged. But it would be ridiculous to say that Blacks shouldn't use or consume apples at all.

The redneck relation was closer, but well off whites dont refer to themselves as rednecks. They refer to lower class whites with those derogatory words.

Blacks dont have a major separation of class like that, though i can see it happening. I dont know many black professionals/ upper class that use that word and when they do they are describing lesser blacks.

I'm in Atlanta so there is definitely a major separation of class amongst Blacks here. And most Blacks across the scale use the word casually. And Jim Foxworthy is a pretty well-off comedian and his most popular bit is "You might be a redneck"

Yea but blacks do call themselves "apples" with pride.

I agree with the second part but that is not the direct case .

 

[bgoat]

I wish youngins would be more discrete n shit, but they're attention whores who likes to be seen and heard.

 

[movingfeet]

nm, you're right - it's totally appropriate for black people to refer to themselves, their peers and their elders as niggers.

I guess it's also ok if my sister called my mom and grandma her bitch then since they flipped that word and young women call their friends that shit all the time and now it's a term of endearment.

(Just so you know I'm being sarcastic and also making an analogy. I have to explain this to you since you don't seem to be getting it.)

@"Sneak Dissa"‌

Yeah my guy I get that you're using analogies, they're just not good ones. Darkie is insulting because you're taking a characteristic of a person and putting "-ie" at the end of it. It's insulting to call white people "whitey", obese people "fattie", and stupid people "dumbie". Not a good comparison.

Bitch is insulting because it literally means "female dog". Not a good comparison.

And I'm all for respect. If a person doesn't want you to refer to them as "nigga" and you do so anyway, then it's not about the word at that point... it's about the lack of respect shown.

Here's a better analogy for you, @"High Revolutionary"‌ @BlackJerryMaguire‌ and @ShiveDreadz‌ . I want you to bear with me here... :

Say for instance if during the Jim Crow era, racist Whites had used the term "apple" to refer to blacks as a reference to hangings from trees or something crazy like that. And what if they would throw apples at black people to demean them.

Are you all saying that in 2014 a black person eating apples is wrong, self-loathing, or would be "inappropriate"?

And no I'm not talking about them calling themselves "apple" , because that would always be a negative because the term would be in reference to lynchings. I'm talking about eating apples. Should blacks avoid apples all together just because of this one period of time even though there are positives associated with eating it (ie. vitamin c,taste and all that).

Put an apple in the freezer and throw it at somebody then yeah it can still be hurtful. But used in other capacities then no an apple isn't harmful. In this scenario I think somebody could be pro-black AND have apples be their favorite fruit. Yeah I know the whole thing sounds outlandish but I really want to hear your take on that.

And to answer your question @"High Revolutionary"‌ , I'm not caping for the word, I'm caping for myself when people say things like if you say "nigga" you're internalizing racism, or you can't be pro-black if you say nigga. I'm very much black and proud and I say nigga profusely.

And to respond to an earlier statement you made @BlackJerryMaguire‌ , African-Americans are definitely not the only people to use slurs to refer to themselves, and in effect "neutralize" the word or even use it as a sense of pride. Gays did it with "queer" which was originally a slur. Poor Southern Whites did it with "redneck" which was originally a slur. Those are just a couple of examples. It's called re-appropriation and here's an article on ithttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reclaimed_word . No I'm not saying that we should do it because other groups did it but my point there is that it's not unheard of.

the apple analogy doesn't work since apples were not created by Europeans to give to Africanslaves and they weren't force fed apples until they were convinced they liked it. also, apples don't grow in every country that had African slaves so the analogy fails there too. like i said nigger is slur south of the border too yet the african descended people don't use it to self identify

redneck and queer are still slurs although queer was never the worst pejorative for gays. reappropiation only works if everyone uses it (like "neg" in Haiti)

@ the bolded And as i've stated "nigger" wasn't created by Europeans to give to African slaves either. It was the word they used to refer to all darker skinned people, including pacific islanders, arabs, and even Italians. It wasn't created as an insult.

@‌ the underlined and nobody's saying that "nigger" used by a white person to demean a black person isn't still a slur. And who's to say what "worst" is..isn't that subjective? In my opinion being called an ape is a worse insult then being called a nigger.

except it was, the fact is wasn't pejorative in the beginning doesn't matter because the word "black" and "dark" exist in the English language, "nigger" and its variants was used to describe Africans, then spread to being applied to other dark skinned peoples (notice how indians don't call each other coolies and pacific islanders don't call each other kanakas). in fact according to thishttp://chroniclingamerica.loc.gov/lccn/sn84025811/1904-10-14/ed-1/seq-5/

nigger was turned into an insult by whites because it was seen as a stronger insult as opposed to colored or black

there are commonly accepted levels of insults in every culture also.

which asks the question, why do African-Americans use it historically? why are we content to use some european word to describe ourselves?

Its not because of the root of the word (which is latin for black). its because the word (among other things) was used to strengthen the institution of slavery and white supremacy. AFrican Americans use nigger because thats what their slave masters told them they were. hence internalized racism

as of right now IMO, theres only three ways to make the word lose its power: let every one use it regardless of race, stop using it and allow it to become archaic, or have blacks separate from society so it becomes an ingroup out group thing

Holy shit this man gets it

 

[Mister B.]

My thing is simply this:

Old people kill me when they bitch about the word, like this generation or even Generation X made it up...like shit didn't come out in the 70s like....

And people bought that shit, no problem (not to dry snitch on Richard, but he's a prime example)

Or seeing shit like...


(Came out in 1974)

So, on one hand, I GET IT. We all do. It's one of the worst words in the English language when used in it's hate-filled context. One the other, fuck that hypocritical shit. The old folk been made that word 'cool' to say without consequences...don't get uppity with the shit now.

 

[The Lonious Monk]

My thing is simply this:

Old people kill me when they bitch about the word, like this generation or even Generation X made it up...like shit didn't come out in the 70s like....

And people bought that shit, no problem (not to dry snitch on Richard, but he's a prime example)

Or seeing shit like...


(Came out in 1974)

So, on one hand, I GET IT. We all do. It's one of the worst words in the English language when used in it's hate-filled context. One the other, fuck that hypocritical shit. The old folk been made that word 'cool' to say without consequences...don't get uppity with the shit now.

Well too be fair, the same people that are complaining about it now are probably the ones that were killing Pryor back in the day. He was pretty heavily criticized.

 

[Black_Privilege]

African Americans are the only people that take a slur like nigger to describe themselves. Imo it reflects internalized racism

Not necessarily.

Like I said earlier, gays call each other faggots and dykes positively. Women refer to each others as bitches and cunts positively.

I've heard Latinos refer to themselves as Spics before.

Honestly, I haven't heard anyone argue why marginalized people don't have the right to use a word, if they know the history and want to use it amongst themselves to subvert the oppressive meaning behind it.

idk about gays but latinos use nigga more than spic, there's really no comparison in the use of nigger in the Af-Am community and any other group

the only word that comes close is "nèg" in Haiti which has the same root as nigger but is used by all Haitians

Actually i think its def a reflection of internalized racism.

Our brothers in South Africa were called kaffirs (which has the same connotation as nigger) and they actually banned it, they never tried to identify themselves as kaffirs

South Africa:

Act No. 4 of 2000: Promotion of Equality and Prevention of Unfair Discrimination Act.

10. (1) Subject to the proviso in section 12. no person may publish, propagate, advocate or communicate words based on one or more of the prohibited grounds, against any person, that could reasonably be construed to demonstrate a clear intention to -

(a) be hurtful;

(b) be harmful or to incite harm;

(c) promote or propagate hatred.

Not the same bro. The South African word Kafir comes from the arabic word "Kafir" which means infidel or outsider. So when whites in South Africa called blacks "kafir" they were essentially calling them outsiders in their own homeland. A word like that could never be flipped because it represents in it's essence how white people came from Europe, took over and then pushed the native people to the bottom of society.

Like I said, nigger comes from nigre which means Black in latin. Before it was a slur it was a neutral term for Blacks. We also can't ignore connotation. The only reason "nigger" is an insult is because we're told that it is. It'd be different if Black people were walking around calling each other porch monkeys--then I'd see your point about internalized racism.

If its not internalized racism why dont other English speaking people of African descent use it to describe themselves

Like who? Black Canadians do, Caribbean people that I've met here do

Only the ones obsessed with american culture/hip hop

In the islands they dont use that to describe themselves in English speaking africa they don't use it either

What do you think the difference is?

History and difference in culture. Every English speaking country today besides America was a British colony up into the mid 20th century(with a few exceptions maybe). I could ask you the same question: If it's internalized racism then how come only American Blacks use the term? Blacks worldwide were oppressed under similar conditions. I just think American Blacks reacted differently then Blacks that were under the British sphere of influence, but I don't believe Blacks in America have lower self-esteem than Blacks elsewhere.

Every nation in the western hemisphere had slavery yet only american blacks use slurs to identify themselves. Nigger is a slur on all English speaking countries.

And honestly do believe that african -americans have more successfully internalized white supremacy than other groups due to differences in the type of slavery in america

I went to Botswana and people my age there would use nigga frequently. :-??

i bet they were into American culture correct?

@stiff African-Americans dont use nigger to refer to themselves because the root means black so the point is moot

@BlackJerryMaguire‌ I don't disagree with this. What I'm going against is the argument/belief that we shouldn't refer to ourselves as nigga because the term "nigger" was invented to demean us, or because it's somehow connected self-loathing or anything like that.

Like @Cunt_Lyfe‌ said there are way more pressing issues that we as people should be worried about and the "n-word debate" to me is really a non-issue and a distraction.

I still believe its a sign of internalized racism i don't believe we should be using that to describe ourselves. It was not created as a slur you are correct but it is something we all agree is slur

So when a black man refers to his best friend as "my nigga" it's still a slur then?

yes

so you not my nigga b?

 

[mc317]

 

[Stiff]

nm, you're right - it's totally appropriate for black people to refer to themselves, their peers and their elders as niggers.

I guess it's also ok if my sister called my mom and grandma her bitch then since they flipped that word and young women call their friends that shit all the time and now it's a term of endearment.

(Just so you know I'm being sarcastic and also making an analogy. I have to explain this to you since you don't seem to be getting it.)

@"Sneak Dissa"‌

Yeah my guy I get that you're using analogies, they're just not good ones. Darkie is insulting because you're taking a characteristic of a person and putting "-ie" at the end of it. It's insulting to call white people "whitey", obese people "fattie", and stupid people "dumbie". Not a good comparison.

Bitch is insulting because it literally means "female dog". Not a good comparison.

And I'm all for respect. If a person doesn't want you to refer to them as "nigga" and you do so anyway, then it's not about the word at that point... it's about the lack of respect shown.

Here's a better analogy for you, @"High Revolutionary"‌ @BlackJerryMaguire‌ and @ShiveDreadz‌ . I want you to bear with me here... :

Say for instance if during the Jim Crow era, racist Whites had used the term "apple" to refer to blacks as a reference to hangings from trees or something crazy like that. And what if they would throw apples at black people to demean them.

Are you all saying that in 2014 a black person eating apples is wrong, self-loathing, or would be "inappropriate"?

And no I'm not talking about them calling themselves "apple" , because that would always be a negative because the term would be in reference to lynchings. I'm talking about eating apples. Should blacks avoid apples all together just because of this one period of time even though there are positives associated with eating it (ie. vitamin c,taste and all that).

Put an apple in the freezer and throw it at somebody then yeah it can still be hurtful. But used in other capacities then no an apple isn't harmful. In this scenario I think somebody could be pro-black AND have apples be their favorite fruit. Yeah I know the whole thing sounds outlandish but I really want to hear your take on that.

And to answer your question @"High Revolutionary"‌ , I'm not caping for the word, I'm caping for myself when people say things like if you say "nigga" you're internalizing racism, or you can't be pro-black if you say nigga. I'm very much black and proud and I say nigga profusely.

And to respond to an earlier statement you made @BlackJerryMaguire‌ , African-Americans are definitely not the only people to use slurs to refer to themselves, and in effect "neutralize" the word or even use it as a sense of pride. Gays did it with "queer" which was originally a slur. Poor Southern Whites did it with "redneck" which was originally a slur. Those are just a couple of examples. It's called re-appropriation and here's an article on ithttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reclaimed_word . No I'm not saying that we should do it because other groups did it but my point there is that it's not unheard of.

the apple analogy doesn't work since apples were not created by Europeans to give to Africanslaves and they weren't force fed apples until they were convinced they liked it. also, apples don't grow in every country that had African slaves so the analogy fails there too. like i said nigger is slur south of the border too yet the african descended people don't use it to self identify

redneck and queer are still slurs although queer was never the worst pejorative for gays. reappropiation only works if everyone uses it (like "neg" in Haiti)

@ the bolded And as i've stated "nigger" wasn't created by Europeans to give to African slaves either. It was the word they used to refer to all darker skinned people, including pacific islanders, arabs, and even Italians. It wasn't created as an insult.

@‌ the underlined and nobody's saying that "nigger" used by a white person to demean a black person isn't still a slur. And who's to say what "worst" is..isn't that subjective? In my opinion being called an ape is a worse insult then being called a nigger.

except it was, the fact is wasn't pejorative in the beginning doesn't matter because the word "black" and "dark" exist in the English language, "nigger" and its variants was used to describe Africans, then spread to being applied to other dark skinned peoples (notice how indians don't call each other coolies and pacific islanders don't call each other kanakas). in fact according to thishttp://chroniclingamerica.loc.gov/lccn/sn84025811/1904-10-14/ed-1/seq-5/

nigger was turned into an insult by whites because it was seen as a stronger insult as opposed to colored or black

there are commonly accepted levels of insults in every culture also.

which asks the question, why do African-Americans use it historically? why are we content to use some european word to describe ourselves?

Its not because of the root of the word (which is latin for black). its because the word (among other things) was used to strengthen the institution of slavery and white supremacy. AFrican Americans use nigger because thats what their slave masters told them they were. hence internalized racism

as of right now IMO, theres only three ways to make the word lose its power: let every one use it regardless of race, stop using it and allow it to become archaic, or have blacks separate from society so it becomes an ingroup out group thing

@BlackJerryMaguire‌

@‌bolded Bro we're all on this board speaking English, a Germanic language. With that said, every word we use to describe ourselves and everything around us is going to be European as a result of our Diaspora unless you speak an African language. I don't know about you, but English is the only language I know and that probably goes for a lot of people.

@underlined If that's the case then how come we ONLY use the slur nigga to refer to ourselves? Why don't we call each other coons, jigaboos, spades, darkies, blackies, apes, porch monkeys, jungle bunnies etc. as well? It seems if we wanted to internalize racism with our words we could do a lot better job.

And if you're argument is the case then how come there's no outcry about calling each other "boy"? Black men will be like "that's my boy there" when referring to another grown men to say that's their friend. Slave owners called their slaves who were grown men "boy" to demean them and that practice continued into Jim Crow. So shouldn't there be an uproar over that as well?

I don't think so because when a person says "boy" I don't feel like he's subconsciously saying that he's less than a man because he's black, he's just using an expression. And the same applies to "that's my nigga". Black people even use "nigga" today to refer to people in general regardless of race. Nipsey Hussle had a line on his song "1 of 1" where he said "I'ma make these cracker niggas respect my mind" . Since he modified nigga with "cracker" he's obviously talking about white people(lol it felt silly typing that but you get my point though).

 

[Stiff]

...

I'm not pretending anything--I'd just like to see y'all discuss other issues with the same fervor. The usage of the n-word in the Black community is NOT an issue to me at all. It's nowhere near as pressing as someone Black being killed every 36 hours for looking suspicious, or the fact that more Black men will be incarcerated at higher rates due to systematic racism. When I think about the broader scope of our problems, 16 year old Black kids calling each other nigga doesn't matter to me in the slightest.

First of all all of these topics come up on this site pretty regularly. Second, you can't act like you're aware and conscious of racism and related issues but completely ignore the psychological aspect of it. If young black men are identifying themselves as the same term that racist whites created to describe them as something that is less than human how can think that isn't going to be self-destructive?

What you call "looking suspicious" a racist white would just consider a "nigger". When you say 16 year old black kids are killing each other and they call each other "nigga" guess what whites call them? When you say black men are incarcerated at higher rates due to systemic racism, a racist just thinks "there's a lot of niggers in jail."

I'm not sure how you're able to remove the word from its context so easily.

As I explained earlier, no matter how common it is to believe that point, it's simply not true. I tried to give you that knowledge, and was prepared to provide you with proof and evidence but you called me "pseudo-intellectual". But then you come dropping false statements and historical inaccuracies to support your argument. And to me that's extremely corny. I get it, you a old dude that's probably stuck in your ways and not really interested in learning new points of view anymore. Cool, that's on you. But don't insult me because I have a different perspective and an open mind.

I'm not advocating for "nigga". If you don't want to use it and have your reasons not to, then don't use it. I respect that. But when you hear me or anybody from my generation use it either postively or neutrally, don't talk down on them or berate them under false historical pretenses. That's ignorant. Ignorance is more harmful to the black community then any one word has even been or will ever be.

 

[blacktux]

Using nigga is ignorant in itself. And anyone that actually HAS knowledge that still uses that word is an idiot.

 

[Stiff]

Using nigga is ignorant in itself. And anyone that actually HAS knowledge that still uses that word is an idiot.

I have knowledge...I use nigga...I'm not an idiot. I explained why I don't think it's so bad to use it. Otherwise we're going to have to agree to disagree.

 

[blacktux]

I can roll with that.

 

[twatgetta]

Somebody shoulda played the knock out game on the old geezer...Worldstar!...

 

[32DaysOfInfiniti]

Calling your elders a nigga is a no no

 

[twatgetta]

Calling your elders a nigga is a no no

But robbin em, sellin drugs in front of they house, killin' they kids, and breakin' into they house is a yes, yes? ...FOH

Niggers got they priorities all fucked up.

 

[The Lonious Monk]

Calling your elders a nigga is a no no

But robbin em, sellin drugs in front of they house, killin' they kids, and breakin' into they house is a yes, yes? ...FOH

Niggers got they priorities all fucked up.

Why do you feel saying one shouldn't be done excuses the other? You can believe all of the above are wrongful acts.

 

[twatgetta]

Calling your elders a nigga is a no no

But robbin em, sellin drugs in front of they house, killin' they kids, and breakin' into they house is a yes, yes? ...FOH

Niggers got they priorities all fucked up.

Why do you feel saying one shouldn't be done excuses the other? You can believe all of the above are wrongful acts.

Because callin' a old black dude a nigger is the LEAST of the problems in the Black community. Blacks need to learn how to pick the right battles and leave the petty bullshit alone. Because If Richard Pryor called his ass a nigger he'd ask for his autograph instead of talking shit to the youngster. HE's part of the reason the youth buckin' the elderly today.

 

[The Lonious Monk]

Calling your elders a nigga is a no no

But robbin em, sellin drugs in front of they house, killin' they kids, and breakin' into they house is a yes, yes? ...FOH

Niggers got they priorities all fucked up.

Why do you feel saying one shouldn't be done excuses the other? You can believe all of the above are wrongful acts.

Because callin' a old black dude a nigger is the LEAST of the problems in the Black community. Blacks need to learn how to pick the right battles and leave the petty bullshit alone. Because If Richard Pryor called his ass a nigger he'd ask for his autograph instead of talking shit to the youngster. HE's part of the reason the youth buckin' the elderly today.

lol It's also the easiest to solve. Being respectful, doesn't take any time away from handling bigger issues at all. It's not like refraining from calling old black people "Nigga" is going to make it so you can go volunteer at black schools or donate money to black causes.

 

[SneakDZA]

Basically it comes down to people are gonna do what they want to do. It's easier to justify bad behavior by saying there's worse behavior since that way you don't have to ever do anything at all.

If someone's of the opinion that there's nothing wrong with what they do that's one thing but if they acknowledge it's wrong but sidestep it by pointing in another direction it's just a cop-out.

If anything I can look at it like it's a habit like smoking cigarettes... some people try to quit, some people make excuses, some people don't care... and then you have the really special ones that think for some reason that it really isn't all that bad for you since we're breathing polluted air anyway.