To those who believe in a kind and merciful god....why is the world so hostile to life?

[alissowack]

David Shayler is definitely not the Messiah. He doesn't "speak" as one who transcends this world...and I don't mean that some sparks needed to be flying when he said something. I'm mean...he was not The Word. He didn't identify himself...through his words...that he was the way, the truth, and the life.

You've opened up a HUGE can of worms here.....are you sure you want to take the bait? I'm giving you a chance to back out.

I will accept. I saw the second vid to come to my first conclusion. Just in case I missed something...I saw the first and it confirmed my stance. He said, "don't follow me...follow the way". He's is only interested in teaching the way...not personifying it. Just about anybody can expose the corruptions of government. He's done nothing to expose the heart of man.

How would he expose the heart of man though, by criticizing things like abortion, pornography or sex outside marriage? Jesus didn't even criticize slavery.

And out of curiosity, why should David Shayler "personify" the way when Jesus didn't really personify it either? It's not like Jesus ever became an undefeated general in battle and convinced the entire world the religion of Yahweh is best. That's what the Biblical messiah was supposed to do.

At the heart of all of the wrongs done in life is self-centeredness; it's my way at the expense of compromising yours. He does nothing to point that out.

There is a saying that is a rarity these days...a man is only as good as his word. It is the belief that Jesus was good because his word was good. When Jesus said something in the Bible, his listeners knew he stood by them whether they thought he was telling the truth or not. It put people in a position to have to either accept him or reject him...which is not what this guy is doing.

 

[kingblaze84]

David Shayler is definitely not the Messiah. He doesn't "speak" as one who transcends this world...and I don't mean that some sparks needed to be flying when he said something. I'm mean...he was not The Word. He didn't identify himself...through his words...that he was the way, the truth, and the life.

You've opened up a HUGE can of worms here.....are you sure you want to take the bait? I'm giving you a chance to back out.

I will accept. I saw the second vid to come to my first conclusion. Just in case I missed something...I saw the first and it confirmed my stance. He said, "don't follow me...follow the way". He's is only interested in teaching the way...not personifying it. Just about anybody can expose the corruptions of government. He's done nothing to expose the heart of man.

How would he expose the heart of man though, by criticizing things like abortion, pornography or sex outside marriage? Jesus didn't even criticize slavery.

And out of curiosity, why should David Shayler "personify" the way when Jesus didn't really personify it either? It's not like Jesus ever became an undefeated general in battle and convinced the entire world the religion of Yahweh is best. That's what the Biblical messiah was supposed to do.

At the heart of all of the wrongs done in life is self-centeredness; it's my way at the expense of compromising yours. He does nothing to point that out.

There is a saying that is a rarity these days...a man is only as good as his word. It is the belief that Jesus was good because his word was good. When Jesus said something in the Bible, his listeners knew he stood by them whether they thought he was telling the truth or not. It put people in a position to have to either accept him or reject him...which is not what this guy is doing.

Okay, but there are at least ten other people right now, probably more than that, who claim to be Jesus Christ or the messiah reborn. So doesn't that bring up the possibility that Jesus was just another David Shayler, who says nice things but really wasn't the "messiah" OT prophecies spoke about? David Shayler has spoken on other flaws in human nature by the way .

Some people have theorized maybe a Jesus look alike came to Peter and the others who saw Jesus after he died. Just wondering if those possibilities ever crossed by you, because they did for me when I realized how many "Christs" or messiahs in history have been out there. It's a huge reason I started questioning my former religion in Catholic school.

 

[alissowack]

David Shayler is definitely not the Messiah. He doesn't "speak" as one who transcends this world...and I don't mean that some sparks needed to be flying when he said something. I'm mean...he was not The Word. He didn't identify himself...through his words...that he was the way, the truth, and the life.

You've opened up a HUGE can of worms here.....are you sure you want to take the bait? I'm giving you a chance to back out.

I will accept. I saw the second vid to come to my first conclusion. Just in case I missed something...I saw the first and it confirmed my stance. He said, "don't follow me...follow the way". He's is only interested in teaching the way...not personifying it. Just about anybody can expose the corruptions of government. He's done nothing to expose the heart of man.

How would he expose the heart of man though, by criticizing things like abortion, pornography or sex outside marriage? Jesus didn't even criticize slavery.

And out of curiosity, why should David Shayler "personify" the way when Jesus didn't really personify it either? It's not like Jesus ever became an undefeated general in battle and convinced the entire world the religion of Yahweh is best. That's what the Biblical messiah was supposed to do.

At the heart of all of the wrongs done in life is self-centeredness; it's my way at the expense of compromising yours. He does nothing to point that out.

There is a saying that is a rarity these days...a man is only as good as his word. It is the belief that Jesus was good because his word was good. When Jesus said something in the Bible, his listeners knew he stood by them whether they thought he was telling the truth or not. It put people in a position to have to either accept him or reject him...which is not what this guy is doing.

Okay, but there are at least ten other people right now, probably more than that, who claim to be Jesus Christ or the messiah reborn. So doesn't that bring up the possibility that Jesus was just another David Shayler, who says nice things but really wasn't the "messiah" OT prophecies spoke about? David Shayler has spoken on other flaws in human nature by the way .

Some people have theorized maybe a Jesus look alike came to Peter and the others who saw Jesus after he died. Just wondering if those possibilities ever crossed by you, because they did for me when I realized how many "Christs" or messiahs in history have been out there. It's a huge reason I started questioning my former religion in Catholic school.

No...if Jesus is the standard in which to measure every other person who claims to be the Messiah. David...and the other false messiahs...are not stirring up the kind of controversies Jesus dealt with in his day. Jesus said things that have brought him praise and left people wanting to kill him all at the same time. David doesn't have Pharisees watching his every move hoping he would slip up.

I never really given thought to a Jesus "look-a-like" appearing before others because I believe the issue isn't whether he merely died and rose again. It's whether he died and rose again...to save mankind from sin. If it wasn't for that, then his death and resurrection...even if proven to be a real occurrence...would be meaningless.

 

[kingblaze84]

David Shayler is definitely not the Messiah. He doesn't "speak" as one who transcends this world...and I don't mean that some sparks needed to be flying when he said something. I'm mean...he was not The Word. He didn't identify himself...through his words...that he was the way, the truth, and the life.

You've opened up a HUGE can of worms here.....are you sure you want to take the bait? I'm giving you a chance to back out.

I will accept. I saw the second vid to come to my first conclusion. Just in case I missed something...I saw the first and it confirmed my stance. He said, "don't follow me...follow the way". He's is only interested in teaching the way...not personifying it. Just about anybody can expose the corruptions of government. He's done nothing to expose the heart of man.

How would he expose the heart of man though, by criticizing things like abortion, pornography or sex outside marriage? Jesus didn't even criticize slavery.

And out of curiosity, why should David Shayler "personify" the way when Jesus didn't really personify it either? It's not like Jesus ever became an undefeated general in battle and convinced the entire world the religion of Yahweh is best. That's what the Biblical messiah was supposed to do.

At the heart of all of the wrongs done in life is self-centeredness; it's my way at the expense of compromising yours. He does nothing to point that out.

There is a saying that is a rarity these days...a man is only as good as his word. It is the belief that Jesus was good because his word was good. When Jesus said something in the Bible, his listeners knew he stood by them whether they thought he was telling the truth or not. It put people in a position to have to either accept him or reject him...which is not what this guy is doing.

Okay, but there are at least ten other people right now, probably more than that, who claim to be Jesus Christ or the messiah reborn. So doesn't that bring up the possibility that Jesus was just another David Shayler, who says nice things but really wasn't the "messiah" OT prophecies spoke about? David Shayler has spoken on other flaws in human nature by the way .

Some people have theorized maybe a Jesus look alike came to Peter and the others who saw Jesus after he died. Just wondering if those possibilities ever crossed by you, because they did for me when I realized how many "Christs" or messiahs in history have been out there. It's a huge reason I started questioning my former religion in Catholic school.

No...if Jesus is the standard in which to measure every other person who claims to be the Messiah. David...and the other false messiahs...are not stirring up the kind of controversies Jesus dealt with in his day. Jesus said things that have brought him praise and left people wanting to kill him all at the same time. David doesn't have Pharisees watching his every move hoping he would slip up.

I never really given thought to a Jesus "look-a-like" appearing before others because I believe the issue isn't whether he merely died and rose again. It's whether he died and rose again...to save mankind from sin. If it wasn't for that, then his death and resurrection...even if proven to be a real occurrence...would be meaningless.

I admit David Shayler isn't on the radar of most religious leaders, but that's mostly because he lives in Britain, a nation where most people aren't religious. If he lived in Iran or Saudi Arabia, he would have been stoned or hung to death for blasphemy. Jesus did bring heat on himself by calling himself the messiah during his time but ironically couldn't even save himself from his persecutors. How can a messiah, a so called god, fail to protect himself from a bunch of humans? He could have made a decent case for him being a god if he fought back and didn't say the words, "God why have you forsaken me". Why did a god comment on another god forsaking him.....?

As far as Jesus saving us from "sin", ummmmm, not sure if that really ever happened. People still suffer from the consequences of original sin right? So in reality, Jesus didn't really save anyone from sin, especially if Jesus couldn't even save himself (and his other followers). People still "sin" too. Now if the Zika virus was not in existence, along with other horrible parasites and viruses, then maybe Jesus dying for us would have meant something, beyond words and catch phrases.

If David Shayler doesn't impress you, you might want to look up James Jim Jones Warren, he had alot of enemies for his time and considered himself The Messiah too.

 

[kingblaze84]

Inri Cristo of Brazil also claims to be Jesus/The Messiah reborn and he has a lot of enemies and followers too, just like the other guy who claimed to be Messiah 2000 years ago
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inri_Cristo

 

[alissowack]

David Shayler is definitely not the Messiah. He doesn't "speak" as one who transcends this world...and I don't mean that some sparks needed to be flying when he said something. I'm mean...he was not The Word. He didn't identify himself...through his words...that he was the way, the truth, and the life.

You've opened up a HUGE can of worms here.....are you sure you want to take the bait? I'm giving you a chance to back out.

I will accept. I saw the second vid to come to my first conclusion. Just in case I missed something...I saw the first and it confirmed my stance. He said, "don't follow me...follow the way". He's is only interested in teaching the way...not personifying it. Just about anybody can expose the corruptions of government. He's done nothing to expose the heart of man.

How would he expose the heart of man though, by criticizing things like abortion, pornography or sex outside marriage? Jesus didn't even criticize slavery.

And out of curiosity, why should David Shayler "personify" the way when Jesus didn't really personify it either? It's not like Jesus ever became an undefeated general in battle and convinced the entire world the religion of Yahweh is best. That's what the Biblical messiah was supposed to do.

At the heart of all of the wrongs done in life is self-centeredness; it's my way at the expense of compromising yours. He does nothing to point that out.

There is a saying that is a rarity these days...a man is only as good as his word. It is the belief that Jesus was good because his word was good. When Jesus said something in the Bible, his listeners knew he stood by them whether they thought he was telling the truth or not. It put people in a position to have to either accept him or reject him...which is not what this guy is doing.

Okay, but there are at least ten other people right now, probably more than that, who claim to be Jesus Christ or the messiah reborn. So doesn't that bring up the possibility that Jesus was just another David Shayler, who says nice things but really wasn't the "messiah" OT prophecies spoke about? David Shayler has spoken on other flaws in human nature by the way .

Some people have theorized maybe a Jesus look alike came to Peter and the others who saw Jesus after he died. Just wondering if those possibilities ever crossed by you, because they did for me when I realized how many "Christs" or messiahs in history have been out there. It's a huge reason I started questioning my former religion in Catholic school.

No...if Jesus is the standard in which to measure every other person who claims to be the Messiah. David...and the other false messiahs...are not stirring up the kind of controversies Jesus dealt with in his day. Jesus said things that have brought him praise and left people wanting to kill him all at the same time. David doesn't have Pharisees watching his every move hoping he would slip up.

I never really given thought to a Jesus "look-a-like" appearing before others because I believe the issue isn't whether he merely died and rose again. It's whether he died and rose again...to save mankind from sin. If it wasn't for that, then his death and resurrection...even if proven to be a real occurrence...would be meaningless.

I admit David Shayler isn't on the radar of most religious leaders, but that's mostly because he lives in Britain, a nation where most people aren't religious. If he lived in Iran or Saudi Arabia, he would have been stoned or hung to death for blasphemy. Jesus did bring heat on himself by calling himself the messiah during his time but ironically couldn't even save himself from his persecutors. How can a messiah, a so called god, fail to protect himself from a bunch of humans? He could have made a decent case for him being a god if he fought back and didn't say the words, "God why have you forsaken me". Why did a god comment on another god forsaking him.....?

As far as Jesus saving us from "sin", ummmmm, not sure if that really ever happened. People still suffer from the consequences of original sin right? So in reality, Jesus didn't really save anyone from sin, especially if Jesus couldn't even save himself (and his other followers). People still "sin" too. Now if the Zika virus was not in existence, along with other horrible parasites and viruses, then maybe Jesus dying for us would have meant something, beyond words and catch phrases.

If David Shayler doesn't impress you, you might want to look up James Jim Jones Warren, he had alot of enemies for his time and considered himself The Messiah too.

Matthew 27:40

and saying, "You who are going to destroy the temple and build it in three days, save yourself! Come down from the cross, if you are the Son of God!"

You're not the only one who felt that way. And far as sin goes...what Jesus saved us from has spiritual implications. Just wanting to be healed of sickness and ailments of the body isn't going to cure the terminal illness of the soul. If Jesus didn't die and rise so that one day my soul will be free from sin, then it doesn't matter if evidence just shows up for all to see.

I'm not just looking for false messiahs that have "enemies". I'm more or less saying this: someone who insist on calling themselves the messiah should bring about a lot of attention.

 

[kingblaze84]

David Shayler is definitely not the Messiah. He doesn't "speak" as one who transcends this world...and I don't mean that some sparks needed to be flying when he said something. I'm mean...he was not The Word. He didn't identify himself...through his words...that he was the way, the truth, and the life.

You've opened up a HUGE can of worms here.....are you sure you want to take the bait? I'm giving you a chance to back out.

I will accept. I saw the second vid to come to my first conclusion. Just in case I missed something...I saw the first and it confirmed my stance. He said, "don't follow me...follow the way". He's is only interested in teaching the way...not personifying it. Just about anybody can expose the corruptions of government. He's done nothing to expose the heart of man.

How would he expose the heart of man though, by criticizing things like abortion, pornography or sex outside marriage? Jesus didn't even criticize slavery.

And out of curiosity, why should David Shayler "personify" the way when Jesus didn't really personify it either? It's not like Jesus ever became an undefeated general in battle and convinced the entire world the religion of Yahweh is best. That's what the Biblical messiah was supposed to do.

At the heart of all of the wrongs done in life is self-centeredness; it's my way at the expense of compromising yours. He does nothing to point that out.

There is a saying that is a rarity these days...a man is only as good as his word. It is the belief that Jesus was good because his word was good. When Jesus said something in the Bible, his listeners knew he stood by them whether they thought he was telling the truth or not. It put people in a position to have to either accept him or reject him...which is not what this guy is doing.

Okay, but there are at least ten other people right now, probably more than that, who claim to be Jesus Christ or the messiah reborn. So doesn't that bring up the possibility that Jesus was just another David Shayler, who says nice things but really wasn't the "messiah" OT prophecies spoke about? David Shayler has spoken on other flaws in human nature by the way .

Some people have theorized maybe a Jesus look alike came to Peter and the others who saw Jesus after he died. Just wondering if those possibilities ever crossed by you, because they did for me when I realized how many "Christs" or messiahs in history have been out there. It's a huge reason I started questioning my former religion in Catholic school.

No...if Jesus is the standard in which to measure every other person who claims to be the Messiah. David...and the other false messiahs...are not stirring up the kind of controversies Jesus dealt with in his day. Jesus said things that have brought him praise and left people wanting to kill him all at the same time. David doesn't have Pharisees watching his every move hoping he would slip up.

I never really given thought to a Jesus "look-a-like" appearing before others because I believe the issue isn't whether he merely died and rose again. It's whether he died and rose again...to save mankind from sin. If it wasn't for that, then his death and resurrection...even if proven to be a real occurrence...would be meaningless.

I admit David Shayler isn't on the radar of most religious leaders, but that's mostly because he lives in Britain, a nation where most people aren't religious. If he lived in Iran or Saudi Arabia, he would have been stoned or hung to death for blasphemy. Jesus did bring heat on himself by calling himself the messiah during his time but ironically couldn't even save himself from his persecutors. How can a messiah, a so called god, fail to protect himself from a bunch of humans? He could have made a decent case for him being a god if he fought back and didn't say the words, "God why have you forsaken me". Why did a god comment on another god forsaking him.....?

As far as Jesus saving us from "sin", ummmmm, not sure if that really ever happened. People still suffer from the consequences of original sin right? So in reality, Jesus didn't really save anyone from sin, especially if Jesus couldn't even save himself (and his other followers). People still "sin" too. Now if the Zika virus was not in existence, along with other horrible parasites and viruses, then maybe Jesus dying for us would have meant something, beyond words and catch phrases.

If David Shayler doesn't impress you, you might want to look up James Jim Jones Warren, he had alot of enemies for his time and considered himself The Messiah too.

Matthew 27:40

and saying, "You who are going to destroy the temple and build it in three days, save yourself! Come down from the cross, if you are the Son of God!"

You're not the only one who felt that way. And far as sin goes...what Jesus saved us from has spiritual implications. Just wanting to be healed of sickness and ailments of the body isn't going to cure the terminal illness of the soul. If Jesus didn't die and rise so that one day my soul will be free from sin, then it doesn't matter if evidence just shows up for all to see.

I'm not just looking for false messiahs that have "enemies". I'm more or less saying this: someone who insist on calling themselves the messiah should bring about a lot of attention.

Well I must say, your faith in him is pretty strong, and I respect that. I know the effect religion has on many people and it's comforting to many to believe in Jesus or whoever is righteous in one's eyes. I guess some people, such as myself, need more evidence to take a doctrine or belief seriously, but I made this thread to understand how and why people can accept a belief in a god that is "powerful" and at the same time allows those ailments and problems in the physical world.

The spiritual world or after life in your eyes is more important then the physical world, and while that possibly can be true, it still seems weird that a god that "died" for our sins allows nature to develop more and more ways to make life for so many humans and animals, especially children, so cruel and horrible. And I don't think you ever said how people as a whole (100% of us) can ever be spiritually "pure". I don't think it's in human nature to be pure of anything.

 

[kingblaze84]

Also @alissowack

What would it take for a Jesus reborn guy to prove to you that he's the real deal? You may be rejecting your own savior for all we know, there are at least ten of them on Youtube as we speak. Some with thousands of followers, maybe more.

 

[alissowack]

David Shayler is definitely not the Messiah. He doesn't "speak" as one who transcends this world...and I don't mean that some sparks needed to be flying when he said something. I'm mean...he was not The Word. He didn't identify himself...through his words...that he was the way, the truth, and the life.

You've opened up a HUGE can of worms here.....are you sure you want to take the bait? I'm giving you a chance to back out.

I will accept. I saw the second vid to come to my first conclusion. Just in case I missed something...I saw the first and it confirmed my stance. He said, "don't follow me...follow the way". He's is only interested in teaching the way...not personifying it. Just about anybody can expose the corruptions of government. He's done nothing to expose the heart of man.

How would he expose the heart of man though, by criticizing things like abortion, pornography or sex outside marriage? Jesus didn't even criticize slavery.

And out of curiosity, why should David Shayler "personify" the way when Jesus didn't really personify it either? It's not like Jesus ever became an undefeated general in battle and convinced the entire world the religion of Yahweh is best. That's what the Biblical messiah was supposed to do.

At the heart of all of the wrongs done in life is self-centeredness; it's my way at the expense of compromising yours. He does nothing to point that out.

There is a saying that is a rarity these days...a man is only as good as his word. It is the belief that Jesus was good because his word was good. When Jesus said something in the Bible, his listeners knew he stood by them whether they thought he was telling the truth or not. It put people in a position to have to either accept him or reject him...which is not what this guy is doing.

Okay, but there are at least ten other people right now, probably more than that, who claim to be Jesus Christ or the messiah reborn. So doesn't that bring up the possibility that Jesus was just another David Shayler, who says nice things but really wasn't the "messiah" OT prophecies spoke about? David Shayler has spoken on other flaws in human nature by the way .

Some people have theorized maybe a Jesus look alike came to Peter and the others who saw Jesus after he died. Just wondering if those possibilities ever crossed by you, because they did for me when I realized how many "Christs" or messiahs in history have been out there. It's a huge reason I started questioning my former religion in Catholic school.

No...if Jesus is the standard in which to measure every other person who claims to be the Messiah. David...and the other false messiahs...are not stirring up the kind of controversies Jesus dealt with in his day. Jesus said things that have brought him praise and left people wanting to kill him all at the same time. David doesn't have Pharisees watching his every move hoping he would slip up.

I never really given thought to a Jesus "look-a-like" appearing before others because I believe the issue isn't whether he merely died and rose again. It's whether he died and rose again...to save mankind from sin. If it wasn't for that, then his death and resurrection...even if proven to be a real occurrence...would be meaningless.

I admit David Shayler isn't on the radar of most religious leaders, but that's mostly because he lives in Britain, a nation where most people aren't religious. If he lived in Iran or Saudi Arabia, he would have been stoned or hung to death for blasphemy. Jesus did bring heat on himself by calling himself the messiah during his time but ironically couldn't even save himself from his persecutors. How can a messiah, a so called god, fail to protect himself from a bunch of humans? He could have made a decent case for him being a god if he fought back and didn't say the words, "God why have you forsaken me". Why did a god comment on another god forsaking him.....?

As far as Jesus saving us from "sin", ummmmm, not sure if that really ever happened. People still suffer from the consequences of original sin right? So in reality, Jesus didn't really save anyone from sin, especially if Jesus couldn't even save himself (and his other followers). People still "sin" too. Now if the Zika virus was not in existence, along with other horrible parasites and viruses, then maybe Jesus dying for us would have meant something, beyond words and catch phrases.

If David Shayler doesn't impress you, you might want to look up James Jim Jones Warren, he had alot of enemies for his time and considered himself The Messiah too.

Matthew 27:40

and saying, "You who are going to destroy the temple and build it in three days, save yourself! Come down from the cross, if you are the Son of God!"

You're not the only one who felt that way. And far as sin goes...what Jesus saved us from has spiritual implications. Just wanting to be healed of sickness and ailments of the body isn't going to cure the terminal illness of the soul. If Jesus didn't die and rise so that one day my soul will be free from sin, then it doesn't matter if evidence just shows up for all to see.

I'm not just looking for false messiahs that have "enemies". I'm more or less saying this: someone who insist on calling themselves the messiah should bring about a lot of attention.

Well I must say, your faith in him is pretty strong, and I respect that. I know the effect religion has on many people and it's comforting to many to believe in Jesus or whoever is righteous in one's eyes. I guess some people, such as myself, need more evidence to take a doctrine or belief seriously, but I made this thread to understand how and why people can accept a belief in a god that is "powerful" and at the same time allows those ailments and problems in the physical world.

The spiritual world or after life in your eyes is more important then the physical world, and while that possibly can be true, it still seems weird that a god that "died" for our sins allows nature to develop more and more ways to make life for so many humans and animals, especially children, so cruel and horrible. And I don't think you ever said how people as a whole (100% of us) can ever be spiritually "pure". I don't think it's in human nature to be pure of anything.

Though there can be a comfort, feeling good is not the reason anybody should follow Christ. People are Christian because of the claims he made. If anything, for his sake, we give up our comforts. We run the risk of being seen as outcast by the claims he made. We are called to spread the message when some of us don't have anything that makes our lives credible to even be listened to. You probably heard of people becoming Christian and have lived scandalous and hypocritical lives. They already have strikes against them before they can even open their mouths. Some of us just don't know how to respond when people reject the message and their lives are much better than ours whether well behaved, more intelligent or financially stable.

I heard this somewhere and I don't know if I am phrasing it right...if there is only one Messiah, then why all of the pretenders? Jesus was a man of the Bible. Anybody who claims they are the messiah must mirror everything about what the Bible says; not just prove they can walk on water or heal the sick. If they are not true to Bible, then they are not genuine.

 

[kingblaze84]

@alissowack

Whoever says they are the messiah must mirror EVERYTHING the Bible says....? Uh-oh......



So after all these years, the Biblical messiah never came. Even Christians acknowledge Jesus will eventually fulfill "all" the prophecies but since he hasn't so far, it makes it impossible to see who the imposters are because all of these messiahs have no proof of being one.

I also find it a little strange that the first resurrection stories of Jesus rising from the dead didn't appear until about 50 years after Jesus died. And how do you explain all the other resurrection stories throughout history? Why should I take Jesus seriously but not take Horus seriously? Or Krishna, who also was resurrected from the dead? Jesus is not really unique compared to the gods who came before him, and after him. Nothing about him stands out compared to other gods.

 

[alissowack]

@kingblaze84

But wouldn't that be a fair standard to those who claim to be the Messiah...to hold them to the very book that speaks about him? The Old Testament scholars did though they were still clueless to who he was in his time. I'm not speaking of having the exact scenarios like going out to a fishing dock to find disciples. I'm meaning...saying things he would have said. I will say that none of the false messiahs will be able to do that. As much as people hold us normal Christians to the fire about what the Bible says, they shouldn't be the exception to the rule.

I've already said in previous posts that the issue isn't about whether Jesus died and rose again...it is "why" he died and rose again. If Jesus died and rose again just to show that he has the ability do it, then as you said there are others who did the same. Lazarus of the Bible died and rose again before Jesus did.

I don't particularly like how we Christians place so much stock on Christ's Return or the Rapture that it is the "comeback" response when someone rejects the message. It's not that I don't believe he isn't coming back. I just don't believe that is why people should believe in him. But with that said, I hope people are made aware of the times we're in.

 

[kingblaze84]

@kingblaze84

But wouldn't that be a fair standard to those who claim to be the Messiah...to hold them to the very book that speaks about him? The Old Testament scholars did though they were still clueless to who he was in his time. I'm not speaking of having the exact scenarios like going out to a fishing dock to find disciples. I'm meaning...saying things he would have said. I will say that none of the false messiahs will be able to do that. As much as people hold us normal Christians to the fire about what the Bible says, they shouldn't be the exception to the rule.

I've already said in previous posts that the issue isn't about whether Jesus died and rose again...it is "why" he died and rose again. If Jesus died and rose again just to show that he has the ability do it, then as you said there are others who did the same. Lazarus of the Bible died and rose again before Jesus did.

I don't particularly like how we Christians place so much stock on Christ's Return or the Rapture that it is the "comeback" response when someone rejects the message. It's not that I don't believe he isn't coming back. I just don't believe that is why people should believe in him. But with that said, I hope people are made aware of the times we're in.

There are several ironies in this post but the biggest irony is that Jesus is completely unable to act in the way the OT prophecies said he would act. You say the Bible is important to pointing out the imposters, but Jesus is one of those imposters by your very definition because he is either unable or unwilling to fulfill the prophecies that would PROVE Jesus is indeed the messiah.

On that note, WHY should people believe in a so called god that can't even live up to the expectations of its own holy book? Doesn't that seem odd and weird as hell? One minute Jesus will fulfill everything in his followers' lifetime, 2,000 years later, he still is unable to do anything. It makes Jesus seem impotent and powerless, just as the Jews 2000 plus years ago said he was. And people are extremely aware of the times we live in, in the age of Youtube and Twitter, Jesus has zero excuse to not show himself by now. Notice during this whole time, you have been unable to prove he is a real messiah. The Buddha said nice and kind words too, why should a random Chinese guy out there follow Jesus and not The Buddha?

Why should a random atheist or secular person follow your boy, especially with all the imposters running around, Jesus likely being one of them?

 

[alissowack]

@kingblaze84

Jesus unable to live up to expectations according to whom...God or man? When Jesus came, the OT scholars...as well as his disciples...was expecting him to establish a kingdom of political significance; a headquarters of sorts, but was mistaken to think that this kingdom was physical. Jesus said he was going to destroy the temple and "build it in 3 days". It was understood as something that was physical...not spiritual. When Jesus said you must eat his flesh and drink his blood to have eternal life, the people of his time took it to be physical...not spiritual...saying in John 6:52, "Then the Jews argue sharply among themselves,"How can this man give us his flesh to eat?"". Jesus tells Nicodemus you must be "born again" and he thought it meant "crawling back into the womb" and coming back out.

I'm basing my answer on those who call themselves the Messiah of the Bible. If some claims to be Buddha, wouldn't you want to base their claims to be associated with Buddhism? You wouldn't reference a different religion.

Let's just say I'm wrong...which I don't mind being...then as the saying goes in my circle...Jesus lied and we are all still in sin. We still have to deal with our selfish tendancies apart from spiritual guidance. We will create a Hell disguised as Heaven by our own shortcomings to live and die in because God's Gift to the world did not deliver. And anyone with physical power and influence will get their utopia.

 

[kingblaze84]

@kingblaze84

Jesus unable to live up to expectations according to whom...God or man? When Jesus came, the OT scholars...as well as his disciples...was expecting him to establish a kingdom of political significance; a headquarters of sorts, but was mistaken to think that this kingdom was physical. Jesus said he was going to destroy the temple and "build it in 3 days". It was understood as something that was physical...not spiritual. When Jesus said you must eat his flesh and drink his blood to have eternal life, the people of his time took it to be physical...not spiritual...saying in John 6:52, "Then the Jews argue sharply among themselves,"How can this man give us his flesh to eat?"". Jesus tells Nicodemus you must be "born again" and he thought it meant "crawling back into the womb" and coming back out.

I'm basing my answer on those who call themselves the Messiah of the Bible. If some claims to be Buddha, wouldn't you want to base their claims to be associated with Buddhism? You wouldn't reference a different religion.

Let's just say I'm wrong...which I don't mind being...then as the saying goes in my circle...Jesus lied and we are all still in sin. We still have to deal with our selfish tendancies apart from spiritual guidance. We will create a Hell disguised as Heaven by our own shortcomings to live and die in because God's Gift to the world did not deliver. And anyone with physical power and influence will get their utopia.

That's the thing about those OT scholars and modern day OT scholars, they were and are right about Jesus not living up to the expectations of the Old Testament. The OT prophecies were mostly about EARTH being saved (world peace)and united into worshipping one single god, and that hasn't happened after all this time. This is why Christianity isn't taken seriously in most parts of the world, and people generally have no reason to believe he was a messiah or savior. Jesus may have meant his "kingdom" to be spiritual but the OT prophecies made clear action was supposed to happen on Earth as well. Therefore, Jesus is not much more impressive then David Shayler or Inri Christo. Jesus was more charismatic then David Shayler (most likely), but world peace is still not here. Neither are "The One".

And assuming you are wrong on Jesus being messiah (you are according to your own holy book), the question of sin is still a debatable one. What is sin, and what isn't? Some cultures have different versions of what is bad behavior and what is good behavior. Humans were born to be selfish for the most part, look at the debts governments run up and all the pollution we create for the world. So to judge humans for being "sinful" and selfish, when we were DESIGNED to be those things, is extremely hypocritical for the god you believe in.

Humans, for the most part, will not change much. They will still murder, steal for land, and do worse. Ironically, Christian nations have some of the worst murder and rape rates in the world. Israel, part of the "holy land", is famous worldwide for the atrocities and war crimes it inflicts upon the Palestinians. Deep, deep irony.

 

[b1grobtheking]

i hope this helps somebody peep the knowledge

 

[kingblaze84]

i hope this helps somebody peep the knowledge

Seems like an interesting video, I'll be checking it out soon, thanks

 

[alissowack]

@kingblaze84

Jesus unable to live up to expectations according to whom...God or man? When Jesus came, the OT scholars...as well as his disciples...was expecting him to establish a kingdom of political significance; a headquarters of sorts, but was mistaken to think that this kingdom was physical. Jesus said he was going to destroy the temple and "build it in 3 days". It was understood as something that was physical...not spiritual. When Jesus said you must eat his flesh and drink his blood to have eternal life, the people of his time took it to be physical...not spiritual...saying in John 6:52, "Then the Jews argue sharply among themselves,"How can this man give us his flesh to eat?"". Jesus tells Nicodemus you must be "born again" and he thought it meant "crawling back into the womb" and coming back out.

I'm basing my answer on those who call themselves the Messiah of the Bible. If some claims to be Buddha, wouldn't you want to base their claims to be associated with Buddhism? You wouldn't reference a different religion.

Let's just say I'm wrong...which I don't mind being...then as the saying goes in my circle...Jesus lied and we are all still in sin. We still have to deal with our selfish tendancies apart from spiritual guidance. We will create a Hell disguised as Heaven by our own shortcomings to live and die in because God's Gift to the world did not deliver. And anyone with physical power and influence will get their utopia.

That's the thing about those OT scholars and modern day OT scholars, they were and are right about Jesus not living up to the expectations of the Old Testament. The OT prophecies were mostly about EARTH being saved (world peace)and united into worshipping one single god, and that hasn't happened after all this time. This is why Christianity isn't taken seriously in most parts of the world, and people generally have no reason to believe he was a messiah or savior. Jesus may have meant his "kingdom" to be spiritual but the OT prophecies made clear action was supposed to happen on Earth as well. Therefore, Jesus is not much more impressive then David Shayler or Inri Christo. Jesus was more charismatic then David Shayler (most likely), but world peace is still not here. Neither are "The One".

And assuming you are wrong on Jesus being messiah (you are according to your own holy book), the question of sin is still a debatable one. What is sin, and what isn't? Some cultures have different versions of what is bad behavior and what is good behavior. Humans were born to be selfish for the most part, look at the debts governments run up and all the pollution we create for the world. So to judge humans for being "sinful" and selfish, when we were DESIGNED to be those things, is extremely hypocritical for the god you believe in.

Humans, for the most part, will not change much. They will still murder, steal for land, and do worse. Ironically, Christian nations have some of the worst murder and rape rates in the world. Israel, part of the "holy land", is famous worldwide for the atrocities and war crimes it inflicts upon the Palestinians. Deep, deep irony.

The earth thing is a little bit of a stretch. If I got this right, you believe that Jesus is suppose to save "the planet" Earth...instead of the people of Earth. I like to think that when someone says they are going to change the world or shock the world...they don't mean they are going to labor in forming a different kind of planet. They plan to bring an ideology or perspective that will alter how people see the world. The OT scholars are wrong in thinking that Jesus came for that "earthly" purpose.

I really don't understand the "body count" card that people play. Whether it's one or one million, murder is wrong. Whether someone says they have killed in God's Name or they killed because someone had on the wrong color shirt, neither one is acceptable. This ought to tell you something...it doesn't take believing in God to kill a person so why do we murder? It's like the only reason people should pay attention to murder if it is religious based. And those who do kill in the name of God, they didn't do so to please God. They did it to please themselves. And just so you know, in the Bible, Israel had enemies. It wasn't this conquest that you wanted to be. God has given His People over to His Enemies (Egypt as an example) for not believing in Him.

 

[kingblaze84]

@kingblaze84

Jesus unable to live up to expectations according to whom...God or man? When Jesus came, the OT scholars...as well as his disciples...was expecting him to establish a kingdom of political significance; a headquarters of sorts, but was mistaken to think that this kingdom was physical. Jesus said he was going to destroy the temple and "build it in 3 days". It was understood as something that was physical...not spiritual. When Jesus said you must eat his flesh and drink his blood to have eternal life, the people of his time took it to be physical...not spiritual...saying in John 6:52, "Then the Jews argue sharply among themselves,"How can this man give us his flesh to eat?"". Jesus tells Nicodemus you must be "born again" and he thought it meant "crawling back into the womb" and coming back out.

I'm basing my answer on those who call themselves the Messiah of the Bible. If some claims to be Buddha, wouldn't you want to base their claims to be associated with Buddhism? You wouldn't reference a different religion.

Let's just say I'm wrong...which I don't mind being...then as the saying goes in my circle...Jesus lied and we are all still in sin. We still have to deal with our selfish tendancies apart from spiritual guidance. We will create a Hell disguised as Heaven by our own shortcomings to live and die in because God's Gift to the world did not deliver. And anyone with physical power and influence will get their utopia.

That's the thing about those OT scholars and modern day OT scholars, they were and are right about Jesus not living up to the expectations of the Old Testament. The OT prophecies were mostly about EARTH being saved (world peace)and united into worshipping one single god, and that hasn't happened after all this time. This is why Christianity isn't taken seriously in most parts of the world, and people generally have no reason to believe he was a messiah or savior. Jesus may have meant his "kingdom" to be spiritual but the OT prophecies made clear action was supposed to happen on Earth as well. Therefore, Jesus is not much more impressive then David Shayler or Inri Christo. Jesus was more charismatic then David Shayler (most likely), but world peace is still not here. Neither are "The One".

And assuming you are wrong on Jesus being messiah (you are according to your own holy book), the question of sin is still a debatable one. What is sin, and what isn't? Some cultures have different versions of what is bad behavior and what is good behavior. Humans were born to be selfish for the most part, look at the debts governments run up and all the pollution we create for the world. So to judge humans for being "sinful" and selfish, when we were DESIGNED to be those things, is extremely hypocritical for the god you believe in.

Humans, for the most part, will not change much. They will still murder, steal for land, and do worse. Ironically, Christian nations have some of the worst murder and rape rates in the world. Israel, part of the "holy land", is famous worldwide for the atrocities and war crimes it inflicts upon the Palestinians. Deep, deep irony.

The earth thing is a little bit of a stretch. If I got this right, you believe that Jesus is suppose to save "the planet" Earth...instead of the people of Earth. I like to think that when someone says they are going to change the world or shock the world...they don't mean they are going to labor in forming a different kind of planet. They plan to bring an ideology or perspective that will alter how people see the world. The OT scholars are wrong in thinking that Jesus came for that "earthly" purpose.

I really don't understand the "body count" card that people play. Whether it's one or one million, murder is wrong. Whether someone says they have killed in God's Name or they killed because someone had on the wrong color shirt, neither one is acceptable. This ought to tell you something...it doesn't take believing in God to kill a person so why do we murder? It's like the only reason people should pay attention to murder if it is religious based. And those who do kill in the name of God, they didn't do so to please God. They did it to please themselves. And just so you know, in the Bible, Israel had enemies. It wasn't this conquest that you wanted to be. God has given His People over to His Enemies (Egypt as an example) for not believing in Him.

Well in your opinion, what is Jesus doing right now? Did he create the Zika virus in your opinion, since you believe he is god? The OT says the messiah will re-make the physical Earth into a peaceful one. Did the Old Testament overestimate the messiah's abilities?

And I agree people MOST of the time don't kill for their god or to please a god. But don't you find it ironic that in many Christian majority nations, violence and rape are often quite high? So it's debatable if Jesus really made people look at the world much differently. People did bad things before Jesus, and in many Christian nations, people are still doing bad and horrible things. I dare say the Buddha did more for world peace than Jesus, Buddhist majority nations tend to be WAAAAAAAY more peaceful than Christian majority ones.

 

[alissowack]

@kingblaze84

There was a time when I felt it was unfortunate that we have to deal with the diseases of the world because I believed a lot of times we came across them by accidental exposure. But lately, I am seeing that we (mankind) may be victims of our own doing; that we have manufactured diseases...or at least the environment for diseases to thrive...and trying to make it seem accidental. The Zika virus is thriving because...people of great influence are allowing it to. "They" want us to think that some unfortunate host (not saying this person volunteered) came across diseases and they are doing everything in their power to contain it. They want Americans to think we have a democracy, that our money is worth something, and that they will give us peace and security when the time arises.

Making a peaceful planet doesn't mean that man will be at peace. Because of sin, it won't matter if the environment changes for the better. We will continue to do what we've always done. If the OT scholars understood this, they would agree Jesus came to save mankind.

I've mentioned that you don't need to believe in God to kill a man. Yet, you are still pulling the body count card. Anybody who does something bad or wrong are doing it for their own selfish reasons. The fact that they are looking for an excuse to justify their wrongs say more about them than the things they are using to justify themselves. God...or that red or blue shirt...is separate from who they are.

 

[kingblaze84]

@kingblaze84

There was a time when I felt it was unfortunate that we have to deal with the diseases of the world because I believed a lot of times we came across them by accidental exposure. But lately, I am seeing that we (mankind) may be victims of our own doing; that we have manufactured diseases...or at least the environment for diseases to thrive...and trying to make it seem accidental. The Zika virus is thriving because...people of great influence are allowing it to. "They" want us to think that some unfortunate host (not saying this person volunteered) came across diseases and they are doing everything in their power to contain it. They want Americans to think we have a democracy, that our money is worth something, and that they will give us peace and security when the time arises.

Making a peaceful planet doesn't mean that man will be at peace. Because of sin, it won't matter if the environment changes for the better. We will continue to do what we've always done. If the OT scholars understood this, they would agree Jesus came to save mankind.

I've mentioned that you don't need to believe in God to kill a man. Yet, you are still pulling the body count card. Anybody who does something bad or wrong are doing it for their own selfish reasons. The fact that they are looking for an excuse to justify their wrongs say more about them than the things they are using to justify themselves. God...or that red or blue shirt...is separate from who they are.

I've heard some people say the Zika virus is manufactured but there are diseases worst then the Zika virus that are definitely natural. Most birth defects have no known cause and parasites are definitely natural too. But let's say people of great influence are "allowing" the Zika virus to thrive, where is the so called messiah in this, as this horrible disease is allowed to run wild and ruin millions of families lives? I guess my version of messiah is different then yours, as I expect a messiah to be active, not lazy and always hiding all the time.

I think a peaceful planet where natural disasters and parasites are not allowed to run wild would make man a lot more peaceful. Less angry people would be running around, less poverty from cleaning up after natural disasters that make people desperate and angry at the world. If a parent loses a child to leprosy or parasites for example, he or she might become bitter people and take their anger on someone else, spreading the cycle of misery or violence going on out there. Natural disasters of the world are probably the biggest reasons I lost faith in all powerful gods, though I remain open to a higher force being out there.