The Vick excuses every year are getting old

[Shizlansky]

So you are going to ignore the INT that Vick threw?

son must have forgot about that LMAO

 

[bow to royalty]

Its only 3 games played. Up thz thread in February then we'll see.

Naw, the problem is that people won't put a knock on Vick, it's always someone else. I'm talkin bout his whole career, not this season. This season his O-line, and refs are catchin blame. Some people are even blamin his receivers. Jackson, Maclin, Avant, Brent Celek, Steve Smith is legit (still recovering probably). Vick doesn't have legit receivers? It's crazy to me

 

[bow to royalty]

I don't agree with that at all. Romo's problems have been Romo's problems. He's had the talent and the system around him. He just makes mistakes. Cutler gets a lot of blame, but people are also noting that he doesn't get good protections. Bradford is new and doesn't even get shitted on like that to begin with. Grossman sucks, so what excuses can be made for him. Orton gets just as much praise as he does hate and is labelled underrated as much as he is bad. Henne sucks. Alex Smith sucks. Favre was garbage his last year with the Vikings. And Kolb was not blamed for what happened last year. People said that he couldn't play behind that O Line, so he essentially got the same excuse that you claim only Vick gets.

I'm not saying that Vick is a perfect QB. He's not. He can't read coverages all that well and he's relatively short so he can't see over the line as well and ends up holding the ball too long. That said, people are looking to blame the bad start on him, and that's ridiculous. When he got injured and went out in ATL, they were winning by two scores, so you can't put that loss on him. When he went out against the Giants they were either winning by 1 or within one score, I forget, but either way they were still in the game. So how do these losses get put solely on Vick. If he's the reason, then why don't they spring forward and win games when he's gone. If he's the problem, then why are they more productive when he's in the game. Clearly, there is more that's not working than the QB.

If you want to wonder why Vick has so many excuses made for him, it's because he gets more blame than any other QB. You throw out names like Grossman and forget that he stunk up the joint on his last team but still managed run straight to a starting position on another team. You bring Romo and forget to mention that he's made some of the most egregious mistakes we've seen from a QB in recent years and yet he's still treated like a darling. On the flipside, Vick has spent most of his time in games this season being ahead of the opponent despite the Offense not clicking on any cylinders, yet all these people are coming out of the woodwork to try and label him a bum. Come on, you want people to stop making excuses for him, then stop going out of your way to bash him.

I dunno how I missed a message this long. What are Romo's chokes? Week 1 of 2011, and a playoff game from 5 years ago? But Vick's INT in the playoffs isn't him chokin? Jackson came out and said they shoulda spiked the ball, organized, then ran the next play. Instead Vick rushed (maybe panicked), yells all go, then throws an INT. That's not chokin? Vick was 11/24 (45%) for 136 yards, 0TD 1 INT in the NFC championship game vs Eagles. That's not chokin in the big game?

People do speak on Cutler's line, that's true. They have 2 when you're goin on ur 2nd straight year laedin the league in sacks and hits. But he doesn't get the Vick benefit of the doubt of "his line sucks, he'd be a beast if he got some protection". Grossman's doin ok so far this year (still early though). The Broncos wanted to trade Orton, and fans chant for the backup to be put in during Broncos games. He doesn't get praise that balances that out. Why does Henne hafta suck? Why isn't he gettin the "give him a good o-line" defense? Favre's line givin up 36 sacks, and Sidney Rice (who was really good the previous season) not playing didn't take any blame off him?

And Romo gets WAY more blame than Vick does. Probably more than anyone else in the league. Romo's not a bad QB and people stay askin if you can win a SB with him, and should they replace him? Last year remember a teammate sayin he should hafta try out for the startin spot again? Look at his numbers and find me another similar QB that gets talked about like that.

You gotta b kiddin me about Kolb. People talked HEAVY shit about Kolb last season. They did say Vick fit better because of the O-Line. But there was still plenty of "Get that bum Kollb out the game. Kolb never should have been startin in the first place." It was a call for Vick to come in, NEVER a call to get a line to protect Kolb. He was not given the benefit of the doubt in Philly.

And I'm not puttin the losses on Vick. I get that that's a team effort. But where are his individual stats? 4 TD's 2 INT and 7 fumbles in 3 games? Dude already almost has an entire season worth of fumbles.

 

[bow to royalty]

bow......

You realize that that TLM scholarship, annihilated your Vick stance...from at least, 5 diff. Angles!!

haha, i'm still alive. Thanks for checkin tho, cuz u never know

 

[tru_m.a.c]

Not gonna front, I fuck with this thread. It's actually not full of emotion catchers lol

 

[htowntx]

Grossman didn't go from the bears straight into a starting job lol
That nigga had to be a backup for a min

 

[bow to royalty]

Grossman didn't go from the bears straight into a starting job lol
That nigga had to be a backup for a min

haha, so did Vick. Even after his 1st year back

 

[The Lonious Monk]

I dunno how I missed a message this long. What are Romo's chokes? Week 1 of 2011, and a playoff game from 5 years ago? But Vick's INT in the playoffs isn't him chokin? Jackson came out and said they shoulda spiked the ball, organized, then ran the next play. Instead Vick rushed (maybe panicked), yells all go, then throws an INT. That's not chokin? Vick was 11/24 (45%) for 136 yards, 0TD 1 INT in the NFC championship game vs Eagles. That's not chokin in the big game?

So you really going to compare what Romo did in Week 1 of 2011 to Vick throwing an interception? And Jackson isn't exactly a strategic genius. Dude gets paid to run really fast and that's about all he's shown the ability to do. It wasn't a bad play call. It was a bad pass. Vick underthrew the ball. He owned up to that. Everyone placed the blame on him for that. What else do you want? Should people go out there and tar and feather for throwing and INT? And who's even talking about choking?

People do speak on Cutler's line, that's true. They have 2 when you're goin on ur 2nd straight year laedin the league in sacks and hits. But he doesn't get the Vick benefit of the doubt of "his line sucks, he'd be a beast if he got some protection". Grossman's doin ok so far this year (still early though). The Broncos wanted to trade Orton, and fans chant for the backup to be put in during Broncos games. He doesn't get praise that balances that out. Why does Henne hafta suck? Why isn't he gettin the "give him a good o-line" defense? Favre's line givin up 36 sacks, and Sidney Rice (who was really good the previous season) not playing didn't take any blame off him?

Because Cutler can't do what Vick can. Last year Vick made big plays and made big games in spite of his Line. When Cutler can do that, he'll get a little more credit. That said, as soon as Vick wasn't lighting up the scoreboard people started to turn on him. They said he lost it in the second half of the season, even though he won most of the games he started even then. Grossman is not doing ok. The team is doing ok because it's winning, but anyone who has watched the games knows Grossman has been looking pretty bad out there. The Broncos wanted to trade Orton more because of their QB controversy than anything else. Same thing with the fans. They just want Tebow to play. The team has kept Orton and he has kept his job as starter. That says more than any fan chants. Henne does suck. Think about it for a second. You just claimed that Orton gets a bad rap because the Denver fans were chanting to have him gone. Well, guess what, the MIA fans were simultaneously chanting to have him come. That should let you know all you need to about Henne. And are we really going to get into Favre? Even if he did get unfairly shitted on in that one season. His career of having his nuts polished by every media outlet for everything he's ever done good or bad more than makes up for it.

And Romo gets WAY more blame than Vick does. Probably more than anyone else in the league. Romo's not a bad QB and people stay askin if you can win a SB with him, and should they replace him? Last year remember a teammate sayin he should hafta try out for the startin spot again? Look at his numbers and find me another similar QB that gets talked about like that.

No he doesn't. Yeah, when he makes and egregious error, people are hard on him, but then when he does anything remotely decent everyone swing back over to his side. Romo's been in the league what 5, 6 years? What has he accomplished? Has he even won a playoff game? Dude hasn't shown himself to be a winner, so of course he's going to get a lot of backlash. He still has plenty of people going to bat for him.

You gotta b kiddin me about Kolb. People talked HEAVY shit about Kolb last season. They did say Vick fit better because of the O-Line. But there was still plenty of "Get that bum Kollb out the game. Kolb never should have been startin in the first place." It was a call for Vick to come in, NEVER a call to get a line to protect Kolb. He was not given the benefit of the doubt in Philly.

Yes, mostly the people who wanted Vick in. But more clearheaded people simply said that you needed to be a player like Vick to survive behind the line. And that's the funny thing to me. People blame Vick and say he holds the ball too long and it's all his fault. Well, why couldn't Kolb get it done? Why was he getting sacked and hit so much? If all the problem was with Vick, then he should have been able to thrive right?

And I'm not puttin the losses on Vick. I get that that's a team effort. But where are his individual stats? 4 TD's 2 INT and 7 fumbles in 3 games? Dude already almost has an entire season worth of fumbles.

Dog, you just putting up numbers. Fumbles and INTs go to a particular player, but they aren't alway's that player's fault. For instance, one of Vick's INT's game from Steve Smith bobbling the pass and it dropping into a defender's hands. Is it Vick's fault that Smith didn't catch a pass that was right in his hands? And about half of those fumbles came from Vick being hit from behind by completely unchecked defenders. Any QB is going to fumble when that happens. Look at Cutler, he's in pretty much the same position and look how many fumbles and sacks he has. If the protection is not in sync with the plays, you're going to have fumbles and sacks, that's just the way it goes. I'm not taking all the blame from Vick. The other INT was his fault and so were the other half of the fumbles, but again the entire offense is out of sync not just one player. No matter how good a QB is, anyone is going to look bad when nothing is clicking for a team.

 

[bow to royalty]

So you really going to compare what Romo did in Week 1 of 2011 to Vick throwing an interception? And Jackson isn't exactly a strategic genius. Dude gets paid to run really fast and that's about all he's shown the ability to do. It wasn't a bad play call. It was a bad pass. Vick underthrew the ball. He owned up to that. Everyone placed the blame on him for that. What else do you want? Should people go out there and tar and feather for throwing and INT? And who's even talking about choking?

Because Cutler can't do what Vick can. Last year Vick made big plays and made big games in spite of his Line. When Cutler can do that, he'll get a little more credit. That said, as soon as Vick wasn't lighting up the scoreboard people started to turn on him. They said he lost it in the second half of the season, even though he won most of the games he started even then. Grossman is not doing ok. The team is doing ok because it's winning, but anyone who has watched the games knows Grossman has been looking pretty bad out there. The Broncos wanted to trade Orton more because of their QB controversy than anything else. Same thing with the fans. They just want Tebow to play. The team has kept Orton and he has kept his job as starter. That says more than any fan chants. Henne does suck. Think about it for a second. You just claimed that Orton gets a bad rap because the Denver fans were chanting to have him gone. Well, guess what, the MIA fans were simultaneously chanting to have him come. That should let you know all you need to about Henne. And are we really going to get into Favre? Even if he did get unfairly shitted on in that one season. His career of having his nuts polished by every media outlet for everything he's ever done good or bad more than makes up for it.

No he doesn't. Yeah, when he makes and egregious error, people are hard on him, but then when he does anything remotely decent everyone swing back over to his side. Romo's been in the league what 5, 6 years? What has he accomplished? Has he even won a playoff game? Dude hasn't shown himself to be a winner, so of course he's going to get a lot of backlash. He still has plenty of people going to bat for him.

Yes, mostly the people who wanted Vick in. But more clearheaded people simply said that you needed to be a player like Vick to survive behind the line. And that's the funny thing to me. People blame Vick and say he holds the ball too long and it's all his fault. Well, why couldn't Kolb get it done? Why was he getting sacked and hit so much? If all the problem was with Vick, then he should have been able to thrive right?

Dog, you just putting up numbers. Fumbles and INTs go to a particular player, but they aren't alway's that player's fault. For instance, one of Vick's INT's game from Steve Smith bobbling the pass and it dropping into a defender's hands. Is it Vick's fault that Smith didn't catch a pass that was right in his hands? And about half of those fumbles came from Vick being hit from behind by completely unchecked defenders. Any QB is going to fumble when that happens. Look at Cutler, he's in pretty much the same position and look how many fumbles and sacks he has. If the protection is not in sync with the plays, you're going to have fumbles and sacks, that's just the way it goes. I'm not taking all the blame from Vick. The other INT was his fault and so were the other half of the fumbles, but again the entire offense is out of sync not just one player. No matter how good a QB is, anyone is going to look bad when nothing is clicking for a team.

When you say Romo's issues people think him comin up short in the clutch. That's why I said choking. What other knocks on him were u talkin about? . And it was 1st down, with just over 40 seconds left in the game when the INT play started. They could have spiked the ball, or gone for a sideline route. It's not a do or die play with 40+ seconds left on 1st down, even if you are out of timeouts.Desean's a startin player in the NFL, who was on the field when it went down. I can't discount his opinion. Man, I really wish this site didn't go down so you see could Vick supporters defendin that pass. Vick did take the blame, and props to him for that. He's not the problem, his Vick is God fanbase is (not all his fans r like this).

How is Grossman not doin ok completing 59.6% of his passes, 5 TD's 3 INT, 2 fumbles? Vick's completing 59% of his passes, 4 TD's 2 INT, 7 fumbles. Henne does suck, haha, not gonna bullshit about that. But Orton doesn't, and the Broncos should have traded Tebow if there was a controversy. The people that drafted him aren't there anymore, he's not ur starter, and a good number of teams would probably trade for him. Why did they want to part ways with Orton instead? You're right that MIA fans were hype to get Orton though.

I said that people believed Vick was a better fit because of the O-line. I'm just pointing out the force field Vick has around him. Kolb was largely looked at as not being a good QB while in Philly. Even being aware of the line people didn't sympathize with his situation. There was no Kolb fan base saying it's not on him, that line is messed up. It was "Ah well Kolb, tough break". That's really the point I'm trying to get across in this thread. Lot less "ah well, tough break" for Vick. He's protected more than other QB's in that sense.

Cutler has 3 fumbles this season to Vick's 7.

I just think plenty of QB's are in situations as bad or worse than Vick's but it's tough break for them. Vick's o-line is not the worst in the league, but people act like it is. He has a possibly top 5 group of WR's, a top 5 running back, a top 5 secondary, a possible top 5 pass rush. This dude was not dropped into a shitty situation. But people won't hit him with a "ah well tough break"

 

[cobbland]

In a way, Cutler deserves a lot of the criticism he's been getting.

In Denver he had a "head coach/offensive genius" in Mike Shanahan, a Top 10 WR in Brandon Marshall, a Top 10 left tackle in Ryan Clady, and a consistent run game that routinely produced 1000 yard rushers, yet he never made the playoffs in Denver.

He threw for plenty of yards but his touchdown to interception ratio was low (his lone Pro Bowl Season in 2008 he had: 4526 yards, 25 touchdown passes and 18 interceptions).

You can fault Jerry Angelo for "not surrounding Cutler with better talent" or for believing that "a better quarterback makes him teammates better" or even "some quarterbacks succeed, in spite of the lack of offensive talent" kind of like how McNabb and Vick did for years in Philly and Atlanta.

 

[blackrain]

I don't agree with that at all. Romo's problems have been Romo's problems. He's had the talent and the system around him. He just makes mistakes. Cutler gets a lot of blame, but people are also noting that he doesn't get good protections. Bradford is new and doesn't even get shitted on like that to begin with. Grossman sucks, so what excuses can be made for him. Orton gets just as much praise as he does hate and is labelled underrated as much as he is bad. Henne sucks. Alex Smith sucks. Favre was garbage his last year with the Vikings. And Kolb was not blamed for what happened last year. People said that he couldn't play behind that O Line, so he essentially got the same excuse that you claim only Vick gets.

I'm not saying that Vick is a perfect QB. He's not. He can't read coverages all that well and he's relatively short so he can't see over the line as well and ends up holding the ball too long. That said, people are looking to blame the bad start on him, and that's ridiculous. When he got injured and went out in ATL, they were winning by two scores, so you can't put that loss on him. When he went out against the Giants they were either winning by 1 or within one score, I forget, but either way they were still in the game. So how do these losses get put solely on Vick. If he's the reason, then why don't they spring forward and win games when he's gone. If he's the problem, then why are they more productive when he's in the game. Clearly, there is more that's not working than the QB.

If you want to wonder why Vick has so many excuses made for him, it's because he gets more blame than any other QB. You throw out names like Grossman and forget that he stunk up the joint on his last team but still managed run straight to a starting position on another team. You bring Romo and forget to mention that he's made some of the most egregious mistakes we've seen from a QB in recent years and yet he's still treated like a darling. On the flipside, Vick has spent most of his time in games this season being ahead of the opponent despite the Offense not clicking on any cylinders, yet all these people are coming out of the woodwork to try and label him a bum. Come on, you want people to stop making excuses for him, then stop going out of your way to bash him.

Grossman's sorry ass didn't go straight to another starting job...he was on the bench and shitted on and still shitted on for not being good enough...and Romo gets shitted on constantly...the rest though I agree with...

 

[almighty breeze]

this thread has turned into a bunch of numbers and blanket statemnets without context

 

[Idi Amin Dada]

Who else has had an almost 10 year career full of excuses? And multiple excuses, on multiple teams, that legitimately try to put talent around him

Peyton before he won his ring for starters.

 

[bow to royalty]

Peyton before he won his ring for starters.

Peyton's team success was criticized (no defense). But as an individual everyone agreed he was a regular season monster, but his post-season stats weren't nearly as impressive. And Peyton didn't have multiple excuses. Peyton was not on multiple teams.

 

[bow to royalty]

this thread has turned into a bunch of numbers and blanket statemnets without context

I do feel like the stats may be straying from the point I was originally trying to make, you're right. The point (without stats) is that there is no perfect team. Every team has something that could be better about them. This is usually accepted as part of football, and players are expected to deal with it. But IMO Vick's play is being defended because of circumstances other players just have to deal with it, and are not given passes for.

 

[DarkRaiden]

Vick had the SUPER BOWL? HE lost in his first playoff game, so let's slow down with that. And you act like Rodgers wasn't dealing with shit like this

[video]http://www.nfl.com/videos/auto/09000d5d81d933ea/Jones-drops-would-be-TD-pass[/video]

Eagles didn't get lucky with that? Rodgers teammates didn't fail him too?

"I just feel we rushed that last play, and we didn't have to rush it," Jackson said. "That's what I was trying to say: 'Just down the ball, just spike the ball, just kind of get back to the huddle and regroup.' But he called 'all go.' We just ran what was called, so that's neither here nor there. It's just unfortunate." .....That's just the star receiver of the team talkin. But if you wanna just blame Reid for the rush at the end of the game, that's cool too.

So you are going to ignore the INT that Vick threw?

Doesn't matter. If the kicker makes those 10 yard kicks, they win. The only thing the Kicke does is Kick all day. In practice, he kicks, on the sideline, he kicks, all he practices is kicking. He was one of the, if not the best kicker that year by numbers. Yet when it gets time to win a playoff game he chokes not once, but twice, from 10 yards and 3 feet away?? Damn right it's his fault. And Vick threw an INT cause he had no time and was rushing cause he had no timeouts, cause Reid literally wasted one of them on some bullshit.

There are many people to blame for the loss, and Vick ain't one of them. Stop hating.

 

[Idi Amin Dada]

Peyton's team success was criticized (no defense). But as an individual everyone agreed he was a regular season monster, but his post-season stats weren't nearly as impressive. And Peyton didn't have multiple excuses. Peyton was not on multiple teams.

The nigga was on TWO teams. You actin' like he's Kevin' Ollie-in' outchea.

 

[bow to royalty]

Doesn't matter. If the kicker makes those 10 yard kicks, they win. The only thing the Kicke does is Kick all day. In practice, he kicks, on the sideline, he kicks, all he practices is kicking. He was one of the, if not the best kicker that year by numbers. Yet when it gets time to win a playoff game he chokes not once, but twice, from 10 yards and 3 feet away?? Damn right it's his fault. And Vick threw an INT cause he had no time and was rushing cause he had no timeouts, cause Reid literally wasted one of them on some bullshit.

There are many people to blame for the loss, and Vick ain't one of them. Stop hating.

Vick had 40 seconds on the clock, with 1st and 10, when he snapped the ball on the INT. That's not that crunched for time

 

[bow to royalty]

The nigga was on TWO teams. You actin' like he's Kevin' Ollie-in' outchea.

Not sayin he's a journeyman, but he's on 2 respected franchises, that will put talent around their people. Didn't go the Lions and Raiders

 

[R.D.]

Not sayin he's a journeyman, but he's on 2 respected franchises, that will put talent around their people. Didn't go the Lions and Raiders

Falcons didnt