So Pac is not someone who should be celebrated?

[Fazeem_Blackall]

But that's the thing. Pac clearly was NOT as big when he was alive as you all would lead us to believe. Was he moving units? Yes. Did he have hits? Yes. But he was in no way, shape, or form dominating the market...until he died. The majority of his success came posthumously, so how exactly was he some big worldwide superstar pre-death, when he didn't reach that status, til AFTER death?

Just to Jump in on you as far the World Wide Status Pac was discussed worldwide on a largersacle not just because of his music but because of his families Political Positions. His 1st album was attacked not only because of the Kid Claiming it influenced him to Kill But Because His Step Father was Mutulu Shakur and His Auntie Was Assata Shakur two Notoriously Political Cases that have Drawn attention Worldwide due in Part to Assata being Granted asylum in Cuba. His Message and success in music was scrutinised because he was vocal about his politcal views in and out of music and the enviroment that created these veiws. This caused his music to exodus to african youth in a major way while he was alive where he still is held with more respect then over here from what I am told. The only reason the majority of his sales have occurered since his death is because he was only a live for 5 years of his music career and still sold millions domestically and even more in the world wide market, While the larger majority of records released for him have been done soafter death over this now 14 year period which have added on to those Millions while alive figures...

 

[redhandedbandit]

dang fazz for once i can cosign you

 

[KingNative]

Did you bother to read the opening post? Or the link I posted? Redundancy bothers me LOL.

The initial post (and link post) pretty much explain how Pac transformed himself into a "gangsta" type rapper, in order to become popular.

Clearly, nothing about Pac was authentic...but somehow, we give him a pass.

First of all YOU didn't give him anything

Pac was on the whole "Thug Life" thing from his days in Marin City, There's a video of his homies from Marin talking about how they got into it during the late 80's before Pac was with Digital Underground, He didn't just pull the Thug Life thing out of his ass one day to gain popularity, he was on it before he got signed. I don't see where Pac suddenly became "gangsta", to me he always had sprinkles of what can be considered "gangsta" music mixed in with politics(He left the politics behind somewhat in his later albums but who cares). There was no sudden transformation.

 

[7 DAY THEORY CDATISR]

the media hates pac.

even on this lame ass allhiphop site.

they ban and lock pac threads so quick

 

[Punisher__]

I wouldn't say nothing. His thug persona was fake. Absolutely. It got him in the door, and once inside he used that platform to talk about police brutality, drug addiction in black families, teen pregnancy, black on black crime. etc etc.

His social activism was more genuine than any other mainstream rapper past or present. He came from black panther stock, and put his entire career and freedom on the line to shoot two off-duty cops who were harrassing a black motorist. That's real to me.

So we give him a pass because he spoke on social issues? Point taken.

But even still, Pac pretty much epitomized fakeness and its entire etymology. And it's that "fake thug"; "wannabe gangsta" persona that we have come to glorify, which is a MUCH bigger issue (and on-going problem) than Pac speaking on social issues.

 

[KingNative]

Just to Jump in on you as far the World Wide Status Pac was discussed worldwide on a largersacle not just because of his music but because of his families Political Positions. His 1st album was attacked not only because of the Kid Claiming it influenced him to Kill But Because His Step Father was Mutulu Shakur and His Auntie Was Assata Shakur two Notoriously Political Cases that have Drawn attention Worldwide due in Part to Assata being Granted asylum in Cuba. His Message and success in music was scrutinised because he was vocal about his politcal views in and out of music and the enviroment that created these veiws. This caused his music to exodus to african youth in a major way while he was alive where he still is held with more respect then over here from what I am told. The only reason the majority of his sales have occurered since his death is because he was only a live for 5 years of his music career and still sold millions domestically and even more in the world wide market, While the larger majority of records released for him have been done soafter death over this now 14 year period which have added on to those Millions while alive figures...

Co/sign. Probably couldn't have said it better.

 

[Mvpbrodie93]

he's not the GOAT one of, but not the greatest. He's rap's biggest figure, but not the greatest rapper.

Pac is my favourite rapper of all time... and to me personally the GREATEST OF ALL TIME (GOAT)

When Nas was asked to describe Pac in one sentence, these were his words: "... better than Shakespeare"

Pac is the only rap nigga that brought a tear to my eye with his music (I was going through shit at the time) with 'I Wonder If Heaven's Got A Ghetto'...

He still the realest nigga in rap... he exposed his soul to the world, with no frills... his passion for the music is timeless (still unreleased songs 14 years after his passing)

He was human like all of us and made dumb mistakes (who hasn't?)... but like someone said in another thread like Marley to Reggae, MJ to pop, J. Brown to soul... Pac is that dead personification of hip hop music

 

[Punisher__]

First of all YOU didn't give him anything
Pac was on the whole "Thug Life" thing from his days in Marin City, There's a video of his homies from Marin talking about how they got into it during the late 80's before Pac was with Digital Underground, He didn't just pull the Thug Life thing out of his ass one day to gain popularity, he was on it before he got signed. I don't see where Pac suddenly became "gangsta", to me he always had sprinkles of what can be considered "gangsta" music mixed in with politics(He left the politics behind somewhat in his later albums but who cares). There was no sudden transformation.

Of course he was on it before he got signed. The third quoted paragraph in the opening post, pretty much addresses this, indirectly. Record execs (and Pac) both knew the type of artist he'd have to be and the type of life he'd have to portray, if they were going to profit.
I'm confident the entire thing was pre-meditated from the very beginning, before he got signed.

 

[rip.dilla]

he's not the goat one of, but not the greatest. He's rap's biggest figure, but not the greatest rapper.

pac is my favourite rapper of all time... And to me personally the GREATEST OF ALL TIME(GOAT)

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^...

 

[Bully_Pulpit]

Bravo! Bravo! Props to threadstarter, good topic.

Should Pac be celebrated? There is no doubt about it. Was Pac fake? My answer is how can someone who spoke so much truth, dropped so much knowledge be considered fake. Pac spoke on subjects that they didnt like, so they had him removed. He was gaining too many followers and he became a threat. To this day we dont know who killed Pac, really ask yourself why that is and just who could orchestrate such a thing? I think thats the questions we should be asking.

 

[Punisher__]

Bravo! Bravo! Props to threadstarter, good topic.

Should Pac be celebrated? There is no doubt about it. Was Pac fake? My answer is how can someone who spoke so much truth, dropped so much knowledge be considered fake. Pac spoke on subjects that they didnt like, so they had him removed. He was gaining too many followers and he became a threat. To this day we dont know who killed Pac, really ask yourself why that is and just who could orchestrate such a thing? I think thats the questions we should be asking.

Much respect. And I'm glad my threads are so inspiring.

Why do we give passes to Pac for being a fake thug, just because he spoke on social issues...when we all know that "wannabe gangsta" image has been an ongoing problem within hip hop circles, ever since Pac popularized such a persona?

 

[rip.dilla]

Much respect. And I'm glad my threads are so inspiring.

Why do we give passes to Pac for being a fake thug, just because he spoke on social issues...when we all know that "wannabe gangsta" image has been an ongoing problem within hip hop circles, ever since Pac popularized such a persona?

Dude we argue about this shit everyday... for every rapper there is always sort of an alter ego thing going on... it just adds to the entertainment factor

Example... Scarface is just a film, entirely fiction... but it has had a massive influence on hip hop culture

 

[Punisher__]

Dude we argue about this shit everyday... for every rapper there is always sort of an alter ego thing going on... it just adds to the entertainment factor

Example... Scarface is just a film, entirely fiction... but it has had a massive influence on hip hop culture

You're still giving an unwarranted pass to Pac.

Fact is, he (and the record execs) knew exactly what he had to do to profit. So instead of being organic with it, he purposely markets himself as a gangsta, because with a gangsta image comes notoriety, and with notoriety comes sales, and with sales comes profit.

Why do people not see the problem with this?

If I didn't see the business side of it, I'd think Pac was secretly working for the KKK.

 

[south4life]

@genstasia

Thug Life stood for, The Hate U Give Lil Infants Fucks Everybody.

It was a code of laws for street cats, that Pac and his stepdad Mutulu came up with together.

The reason why Pac wanted out of Death Row so bad was because, he had a vision to be bigger than Hip Hop and he wanted to be in politics.

Pac was going to start something that was like The Black Panthers and the government did not want another Black Panther Party.

That's why he was starting the One Nation project and he had many charities that they tried to keep quiet.

Unlike alot of rappers that get into a position of power with alot of money and forget everybody else, Pac helped people and made sure they were taken care of.

Pac let people live with him, he said that he knew how it felt to be homeless and he had people help him, o he wanted to do the same.

That's why he died broke, he was using his money to help people and to this day, he is helping people thru death.

Everybody talks about his mom only wanted the money, that's not true, she lives in a nice sized house in Lumberton, North Carolina that she has lived in since 1995.

She doesn't have a bunch of cars, she didn't buy a big ass mansion and she made a small gravesite in the back yard of her house in honor of her son.

She uses that money for charities that Pac started, she built that School of Performing Arts in Stone Mountain, Georgia to give kids the same opportunity that Pac got when he went to a Performing Arts School in Baltimore.

She is not exploiting her son, she is doing what he wanted to be done, she is doing what is right and that is why Tupac's Estate is making more money then some rappers who have been in the game for a longtime.

That's what Pac's legacy is, he was for the Black People, he wanted to help his people and after getting shot and going to jail, he came out angry.

I would be angry too after going thru that but, to me it looked like he was about to mature and we will never know now.

 

[Mvpbrodie93]

yes, PAC should be celebrate. He's one of the greats, everyone has flaws.

 

[Bully_Pulpit]

Much respect. And I'm glad my threads are so inspiring.

Why do we give passes to Pac for being a fake thug, just because he spoke on social issues...when we all know that "wannabe gangsta" image has been an ongoing problem within hip hop circles, ever since Pac popularized such a persona?

The same reason we give people like Mobb Deep, Snoop, NWA, Ice-T and countless others a pass for perpetuating the thug image, Pac didn't start that thug shit not by a longshot, but he did bring it to another level, but I wouldnt necessarily say that it was his intention to do so, the media was a tool to push that image, being with death row helped also, most of his "thug persona" shit was with death row, and so was snoop and a list of others, Pac did what he had to do, Suge bails him out but with a price, he'd have to sell his image . Pac was a transformational figure that changed rap forever with his stances on social issues, his style, his emotion but because the media perpetuated him as a thug, that what these idiots think he was about, Pac was was way bigger than that.

 

[gee757]

If I didn't see the business side of it, I'd think Pac was secretly working for the KKK.

u got pac confused wit that sambo hatin coon CUUUURRY lol

 

[hrap-120]

Alot of erroneous statments

People still dont understand the meaning behind "Thug-Life"....go do the research.

Did 'Pac grow up around Crips & Bloods..from 16-17 he lived in the "Jungle" in Marin City, California with Ray Luv...housing projects, gang infested, and he was tight with Ryan D. from 51.50, known bloods. He was rolling with Big Syke an O.G. Crip when he was 20. Questioning his "gangsta" is foolish.

LOL, when you grew up around Black Panthers like Geronimo Pratt, Revolutionaries like Mutulu Shakur, and your Godmother is Assatta Shakur..you don't need any low-level gangbangers to vouch for your pedigree and "gangsta".

Much respect. And I'm glad my threads are so inspiring.

Why do we give passes to Pac for being a fake thug, just because he spoke on social issues...when we all know that "wannabe gangsta" image has been an ongoing problem within hip hop circles, ever since Pac popularized such a persona?

2Pac was far from a "fake-thug" he reinvented the word "thug" based on his lifestyle and belief's and became the new definition of a "thug". Wanna-bee's dont shoot cops they run from cops. Wanna-bee's get their chains snatched and dont fight back.

Was he affiliated with crips & bloods of course thats the West-Coast.

How many "gangsta's" in rap music can you name that bust their guns and know who to bust their guns at???

 

[hrap-120]

You're still giving an unwarranted pass to Pac.

Fact is, he (and the record execs) knew exactly what he had to do to profit. So instead of being organic with it, he purposely markets himself as a gangsta, because with a gangsta image comes notoriety, and with notoriety comes sales, and with sales comes profit.
Why do people not see the problem with this?

If I didn't see the business side of it, I'd think Pac was secretly working for the KKK.

What is your definition of a "gangsta image".

 

[Fazeem_Blackall]

Just to Jump in on you as far the World Wide Status Pac was discussed worldwide on a largersacle not just because of his music but because of his families Political Positions. His 1st album was attacked not only because of the Kid Claiming it influenced him to Kill But Because His Step Father was Mutulu Shakur and His Auntie Was Assata Shakur two Notoriously Political Cases that have Drawn attention Worldwide due in Part to Assata being Granted asylum in Cuba. His Message and success in music was scrutinised because he was vocal about his politcal views in and out of music and the enviroment that created these veiws. This caused his music to exodus to african youth in a major way while he was alive where he still is held with more respect then over here from what I am told. The only reason the majority of his sales have occurered since his death is because he was only a live for 5 years of his music career and still sold millions domestically and even more in the world wide market, While the larger majority of records released for him have been done soafter death over this now 14 year period which have added on to those Millions while alive figures...

Come on Pun, why ya dodging Fam lets show the heathens how Civilized debate can be without the man love or catching feelings on facts...