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FuriousOne;6270387 said:SnuffDaddy;6270304 said:FuriousOne;6270256 said:SnuffDaddy;6270239 said:No, you misssed my point. I didnt say he never got big. But he was mostly big due to his controversy. Thats why he was so talked about in 1993-94. Thats when he really started to get on people's radar. Cuz most only knew of him from Juice and "Brenda's Got A Baby". The media controversy is what propelled him. Then, when he got shot and all that and went to prison it only furthered his career.
My point, however, was that in terms of the public. When i said "your avarge controversial rapper that people loved, hated etc" is just like Drake, Wayne, 50 Cent in his prime or whoever else. Meaning, you wouldve had people who loved 2pac, bandwagon fans, people who hated him, people who wouldve called him fake, soft, lame, attention whoring, sold out - just like they did back then and so on.
He, nor Biggie, was different from anybody else in terms of those things. But the way people talk about how the rap game wouldve been better if they were alive, or how Jesus like they were its just ridiculous.
It was partially controversy as much as NWA had controversy. Pac rode that NWA wave from the jump and allowed controversy to influence his music as much as the public. Difference is, Pac actually came from a background that would influence many of his political views on his first album and i would say his message was far more genuine then NWA because he was taught it from youth, and his parents lived it. That's probably one of his reasons for shitting on Ice Cube. He was obviously going through something and wasn't just doing it for a media circus. I can imagine that Pac was confused being that he was bought up to be an upstanding citizen taking dance and all but at the same time his step pops was in jail for the most trillest shit and his moms was using.. From the jump Pac had controversy because of how the President viewed his music and his message against police which he really felt as evident by this nigga actually shooting cops (who does that and gets away with it). He did bring a lot of shit on himself though but the bottom line is that his music was dope regardless of his outlandishness, and if it wasn't, nobody would have given a fuck about his controversy. Reminds me of how Vincent Van Gogh was a crazy nigga but created a masterpiece by putting his feelings on canvas.
Ugh, no sign. Background means what exactly? Public Enemy had waaaaay more of an influence on the social concious than 2pac EVER had. Them as well as the 5%ers were the main influence on the black conscious at the time. Being born into a black panther family doesnt mean you'll have a bigger influence. Shit, Kanye was born in a similar family. That isnt uncommon.
His music? You mean the same way the president had talked about many other rappers like Ice T as well? See what i'm saying. The perception and what the media sold the public is what made him more interesting. The president spoke about many rappers, cuz it was an election year. The reason they spoke about 2pac was because you said, not cuz of his "social influcne" or musisc, again controversy. As far as that shooting theres been ALOT of different stories on that from credible sources. But see, the media hype and perception is what you base it on still. Cuz theres many other similar stories like that with other rappers only difference is that hasnt been PITCHED to you or marketed to you.
Its like how Death Row has been pained with the whole mob-mafia things when theres so many half truths being said but it makes people more interested.
So its alot of hype shit and once again it boils down to controversy and hype. Again, no different than when 50 cent came out, when Snoop came out, when NWA came out or what Kanye is doing now. So therefor, my point was valid. People called 2pac sell out, attention whore etc. And it mostly wasnt about his music just PERCEPTION and HYPE. Thats it.
Are you sitting here telling me that a persons background and upbringing has nothing to do with their behavior? Even outlandish behavior has a root. I said Pac was more genuine then NWA in terms of his message and his origins (maybe not Easy). What that message is when considering NWA would obviously not be in relation to what Public Enemy was preaching because they obviously went further, but still Pac had plenty music leaning that way. Are you judging his character or his music because his music stands by itself even without the antics. As i said, he bought a lot of shit on himself and on others (including big). Speaking on controversy in his early career is a good way to illuminate the fact that even with that controversy, like the President speaking on him, he wasn't making hits until he started putting his personal conflicts down on paper. Controversy didn't help snoop with his second and following albums. It didn't help Kanye with this current album to maintain his consistent sales. You should pay more attention to the Music because that is what keeps Tupac's essence around to this day..
judahxulu;6270418 said:FuriousOne;6270387 said:SnuffDaddy;6270304 said:FuriousOne;6270256 said:SnuffDaddy;6270239 said:No, you misssed my point. I didnt say he never got big. But he was mostly big due to his controversy. Thats why he was so talked about in 1993-94. Thats when he really started to get on people's radar. Cuz most only knew of him from Juice and "Brenda's Got A Baby". The media controversy is what propelled him. Then, when he got shot and all that and went to prison it only furthered his career.
My point, however, was that in terms of the public. When i said "your avarge controversial rapper that people loved, hated etc" is just like Drake, Wayne, 50 Cent in his prime or whoever else. Meaning, you wouldve had people who loved 2pac, bandwagon fans, people who hated him, people who wouldve called him fake, soft, lame, attention whoring, sold out - just like they did back then and so on.
He, nor Biggie, was different from anybody else in terms of those things. But the way people talk about how the rap game wouldve been better if they were alive, or how Jesus like they were its just ridiculous.
It was partially controversy as much as NWA had controversy. Pac rode that NWA wave from the jump and allowed controversy to influence his music as much as the public. Difference is, Pac actually came from a background that would influence many of his political views on his first album and i would say his message was far more genuine then NWA because he was taught it from youth, and his parents lived it. That's probably one of his reasons for shitting on Ice Cube. He was obviously going through something and wasn't just doing it for a media circus. I can imagine that Pac was confused being that he was bought up to be an upstanding citizen taking dance and all but at the same time his step pops was in jail for the most trillest shit and his moms was using.. From the jump Pac had controversy because of how the President viewed his music and his message against police which he really felt as evident by this nigga actually shooting cops (who does that and gets away with it). He did bring a lot of shit on himself though but the bottom line is that his music was dope regardless of his outlandishness, and if it wasn't, nobody would have given a fuck about his controversy. Reminds me of how Vincent Van Gogh was a crazy nigga but created a masterpiece by putting his feelings on canvas.
Ugh, no sign. Background means what exactly? Public Enemy had waaaaay more of an influence on the social concious than 2pac EVER had. Them as well as the 5%ers were the main influence on the black conscious at the time. Being born into a black panther family doesnt mean you'll have a bigger influence. Shit, Kanye was born in a similar family. That isnt uncommon.
His music? You mean the same way the president had talked about many other rappers like Ice T as well? See what i'm saying. The perception and what the media sold the public is what made him more interesting. The president spoke about many rappers, cuz it was an election year. The reason they spoke about 2pac was because you said, not cuz of his "social influcne" or musisc, again controversy. As far as that shooting theres been ALOT of different stories on that from credible sources. But see, the media hype and perception is what you base it on still. Cuz theres many other similar stories like that with other rappers only difference is that hasnt been PITCHED to you or marketed to you.
Its like how Death Row has been pained with the whole mob-mafia things when theres so many half truths being said but it makes people more interested.
So its alot of hype shit and once again it boils down to controversy and hype. Again, no different than when 50 cent came out, when Snoop came out, when NWA came out or what Kanye is doing now. So therefor, my point was valid. People called 2pac sell out, attention whore etc. And it mostly wasnt about his music just PERCEPTION and HYPE. Thats it.
Are you sitting here telling me that a persons background and upbringing has nothing to do with their behavior? Even outlandish behavior has a root. I said Pac was more genuine then NWA in terms of his message and his origins (maybe not Easy). What that message is when considering NWA would obviously not be in relation to what Public Enemy was preaching because they obviously went further, but still Pac had plenty music leaning that way. Are you judging his character or his music because his music stands by itself even without the antics. As i said, he bought a lot of shit on himself and on others (including big). Speaking on controversy in his early career is a good way to illuminate the fact that even with that controversy, like the President speaking on him, he wasn't making hits until he started putting his personal conflicts down on paper. Controversy didn't help snoop with his second and following albums. It didn't help Kanye with this current album to maintain his consistent sales. You should pay more attention to the Music because that is what keeps Tupac's essence around to this day..
He was just starting to peak with that Makaveli joint. Sad. That man was atrue poet. Conflicted but his heart was with the people. Bold little dude. I remember being a shorty and he talked at the Black Expo at a community roundtable. Told the elders to sit the fuck down and talk about organizing the gangs and gaining political power. My O.G. was like "they gone kill that nigga if he aint careful". Didnt know what he meant till way later.
str8 soulja;6271462 said:Its bad but atleast we got k.dot and cole.those two wouldnt sell piss in 06.
silverfoxx;6270954 said:After thinking about this alot, I think many new and current NYC rappers have to push their boundaries with their "sound" because that NYC sound is only catching the backpackers ears and not the majors.
If u guys can start a new revolution and have a "new" new York sound. Guys are talented but they don't wanna let go. Just take the NYC sound and add something new to it.
And stop being so damn bitter all the time!
usmarin3;6259880 said:I wish some of you crybaby niggas would shut the fuck up, open up your ears to what's happening right now. That's including Kendrick, TDE, J Cole, even Drake (when he raps), Krit, Chance the rapper,etc.
Look where hiphop was 5-10 years ago, Franchise Boyz, D4L, Lil Jon,etc.
A verse like Kendrick's verse on Control wouldn't even have made a ripple 10 years ago.
