UW 1.26.14 Who Won?: Loaded Lux vs Hollow Da Don

[FatterThanKat]

Can't give the L to anybody with a flip game that nice.

 

[270crownst]

 

[270crownst]

Click on the link there posing in front if each other...I think joe serious about this. Lol..Joe don't do it ....

 

[hoodsavior]

Joey.. You're unproven.. Hollow is top 5 all time in THIS shit.. You will die a horrible death and I'm gonna love it!

 

[herbalism101]

I really cant see Joey putting himself out there to catch an L like that.....Im sure Joell would tell him it's a bad idea......If it does go down, I can see it as the co-main event to Lux vs Mook.....

 

[za'kiss]

I want to address something right quick about everyone praising Hollow's rebuttals and the way he "broke down" Lux in this. This is going to sound strange because I'm one of the people who was saying this and I voted for Hollow, but after going over this battle multiple times, Lux preempted Hollow's entire line of attack in his third round.

Hollow made a lot of noise about how Lux was greedy, but Lux's whole third round was about telling Hollow to kick his addiction, not because Lux is simply disparaging drug addicts, but because he wants Hollow to be a leader and make money. This goes to his lines about "stand up men don't lean" and "what did they pay you at smack? they probably paid you in smack!" This is obviously brought out the most when he said "I made you the most money you've ever been gave for a match." He hits this point home even further when says "make money, not exuses" and calls him a "welfare nigga" that works for free. He concludes his third round by saying "I'm up here giving Hollow the business model, I'm showing the battle rapper today how to get it tomorrow"

So Lux's whole strategy wasn't merely to expose Hollow for addiciton, but relate this to how it's holding him back in terms of his potential success as a battle rapper, and that Lux's demands for more money is exactly what Hollow should be doing, which helps the entire culture make more profit by requiring leagues to have to match offers.

Also, some are saying Hollow exposed Lux as a hypocrite for doing coke, but you could even ague that Lux preempted this attack as well. Recall, Lux doesn't go after Hollow for doing drugs, he goes after Hollow for being addicted to lean specifically, opiates in particular (codeine, heroin, etc), these are "downer" drugs or depressants. He says how these drugs don't "motivate," leaving you down and "not awake." Uppers, like speed and cocaine, actually do motivate you and keep you awake. While I don't think Lux was necessarily defending his alleged use of uppers, he definitely implies that opiates are worse by making it a point of distinguishing the effects of the drug. It's nice to see Hollow come back, but in retrospect, you could argue Lux preempted every rebuttal that Hollow attempted. Lux's strategy was just so thorough and powerful.

In the end, the only unchecked point Hollow got over on Lux is the criticism of his rap style being too fast and often incomprehensible, which was funny and well executed, but doesn't cut as deep as the work Lux put in. His deeper charge was of hypocrisy, but I think Lux was well prepared for that reply and effectively preempted it. I think the charge of hypocrisy alone misses the subtlety of Lux's entire point, which is against the suggestion that doing for self (making money) is something that should be at odds with the demands and well being of the culture and community (activism). You can do both. In fact, you should do both and that's precisely what makes the culture grow and what's good for all. Lux's strategy was very subtle then, so I think if Hollow really wanted to disarm Lux's third round with a rebuttal, he would've had to explain how Lux is wrong about this (i.e. battle rap should be more art than business, or that high fees won't necessarily yield better business for everyone or the overall culture).

 

[DOPEdweebz]

I feel like a lot of niggas would change their votes and this poll would seven be closer than it is right now. What are the top 10 lines of this battle tho?

 

[NothingButTheTruth]

For all of you watching the battle over and over, your opinion is heavily skewed. Doing so causes you to favor the nigga who has the worst delivery because you begin to understand his rhymes better and what he's referring to, thus making your hindsight opinion biased as fuck.

The fact of the matter is, when you as the listener cannot comprehend a battler's rap line, it is none other than the battler's fault. It's Lux's fault that damn near nobody catches all his lines when they're being said in that exact moment, therefore he loses points for that, not the other way around.

The winner of the battle is the person you named the winner the FIRST TIME you saw the battle. This is a face to face battle which is all about the LIVE moment of when they battled. This is not some on wax shit when you go back and study the lines and make your decision.

 

[FatterThanKat]

Who doesn't catch all of Lux' lines?

 

[mike06]

Shit was dope and i can see either dude getting the 2-1W but i gotta give it Lux...everyone thought he needed to up the ante after the Calicoe battle but he showed up and delivered another stellar performance....Hollow had some nice rds and if i had to give him one it's either 2 or 3 and the 3rd would be based off the fact he went last and he had the prop(which made the crowd go crazy)...but Lux just had more venom in his punches IMO...it real came down to knowledge vs. Street and knowledge won

also the whole time issue was crazy and Jack's no voice havin ass tryin to quiet the crowd was a of a downer to me but overall a very good battle

 

[Lou Cypher]

Majority of the IC has made a very wise decision.

 

[za'kiss]

For all of you watching the battle over and over, your opinion is heavily skewed. Doing so causes you to favor the nigga who has the worst delivery because you begin to understand his rhymes better and what he's referring to, thus making your hindsight opinion biased as fuck.

It's not necessarily the fault of the listening or the viewer if you don't fully catch the meaning of a rapper's lines. I catch most things, and as a seasoned watcher of battle rap, I don't miss much, but sometimes I do, especially for really subtle, sophisticated rhymes and schemes. I gotta go back and watch it. And I honestly love it when a rapper says something that makes me want to rewind it. I love battles that have replay battle. In this case, it was more about processing all the moves and the overall strategies of the two rapper's more than it was about missing specific lines. I needed to see it a few more times to see how effective they were.

Rappers shouldn't have to cater to the lowest common denominator. Why can't a rapper challenge the audience? Why put a limit on what you can say because some people at home might not get it the first time? That's how you stunt progress. Battle rap today would go over a lot of niggas' heads who watched battle rap in the early '00s, but that's because battle rap has come so far technically by rappers like Lux that push the envelope.

The fact of the matter is, when you as the listener cannot comprehend a battler's rap line, it is none other than the battler's fault. It's Lux's fault that damn near nobody catches all his lines when they're being said in that exact moment, therefore he loses points for that, not the other way around.

The winner of the battle is the person you named the winner the FIRST TIME you saw the battle. This is a face to face battle which is all about the LIVE moment of when they battled. This is not some on wax shit when you go back and study the lines and make your decision.

It's not about missing the line because you didn't hear it. It's about having to think about the line and how it works. That has nothing to do with delivery. That's purely about content. That's not the rapper's fault if you didn't get the line and it works.

And OF COURSE you can change your mind about a battle. Imagine some kid who saw this battle who had NEVER seen a rap battle before and didn't pick up on any of the internal references being made in the battle (say to other battle rappers, specific events in battle, etc) and then formed an opinion about who won. Are you saying they should privliege that first opinion even when it's their fault they didn't get the references? You can change your opinion on a battle, and you SHOULD, when it's a close battle and after further viewing it dons on you how effective one rapper's strategy was over another. It's you knee-jerk, close-minded, won't-change-my-mind for no one niggas that should switch up your viewing habits.

 

[Ranxx]

I dont fuck with battle rap at all but I checked it out off the numbers this thread's done.

Lux went hard as fuck really went after that nigga soul but Hollow tore his whole style apart with that 'just cuz u dont understand him..." shit.

Shit was like the surgeon vs the savage I had to give it to Hollow i felt like his bars hit harder.

That "hmm I think I get it face" line wrapped this shit up for me

 

[R.D.]

*yawnnnnnnn*

That approach was better when Jay used it

 

[Ranxx]

We don't wanna hear that bullshit shareem

 

[verbal juke]

We don't wanna hear what bullshit shareem

It's Shariff. Smh

 

[Ranxx]

We don't wanna hear what bullshit shareem

It's Shariff. Smh

 

[Munch59]

watched it 3 times and i still edge Hollow. Lux constructed perfect rounds & thats his strength. after every round it seemed "no way Hollow can come back from this" and yet.....he did. That has to count. the fact people call this battle close speaks to Hollow. and the rebuttals he came up with were immaculate as the pen Lux wrote his attack with.

Thats not why he won.

I lean (pun intended) Hollow because he neutralized Lux's main angle- That i am here to show u a better way by breaking u and building u back up. Not just the 3rd but from the gate. constant references to his holier than thou act and the fact that Lux is a drug user himself and then attacked our reverence of Lux sayin we have pre-made excuses for any flaw he might have and pretend everything he says is deeper than what it is.

When he flip Lux's Calicoe Lost Nigga scheme and not just to say "oh u just like us" but that Lux was a hypocrite more concerned with street praise than his own family is why.

Hollow basically painted Lux as Chalky painted Dr. Narcisse from Boardwalk- a nigger wit a dictionary

^^ Best part about that mini review- not once did i mention punchlines or the crowd. this was a clash of ideology and angles of attack. a debate. a rhyming roundtable... bka Hip Hop

Well articulated. LUX was classic. Hollow brought him down to earth, and painted that picture beautifully! The typical greedy hypocritical preacher man. Looking his nose down at everybody meanwhile he's hiding his own dirt.

 

[za'kiss]

Well articulated. LUX was classic. Hollow brought him down to earth, and painted that picture beautifully! The typical greedy hypocritical preacher man. Looking his nose down at everybody meanwhile he's hiding his own dirt.

Except Hollow didn't address Lux's point that he's not being greedy, that he's giving Hollow the business model for a more successful battle rap career, that he should be trying to make money off his raps rather than doing drugs. And the fact that, while you call him greedy, he got Hollow paid more money off this battle than he ever has before.

 

[hoodsavior]

But I'm lost in how lux is a hypocrite? I think people perceive him to be holier than thou rather than him being it.. The last 2 battles his aim was to uplift thru ass whooping.. But breaking cycles 2 different in both battles...