the official ask lostsamuraisotaku a question about the quran thread

[bambu]

^^^^ Again, an intoxicant is a substance that is poisonous when ingested.

So anyone making this claim is either misinformed or bearing false witness......

 

[lostsamuraisotaku]

Look ..... I asked a question and you made preposterous accusations regarding cannabis.....

1. Prove that cannabis is an intoxicant

2. Prove that cannabis is classified as Khamr

You can do neither sir..... do not waste your time!!!

subhana wa ta'ala knows your heart

 

[lostsamuraisotaku]

^^^^ Again, an intoxicant is a substance that is poisonous when ingested.

So anyone making this claim is either misinformed or bearing false witness......

YOUR SMOKING IT !! DO YOU THINK SMOKING IS HEALTHY???? it is polluting your body !! its makrooh !!! it may benefit when not being smoked ! or perhaps vaporized

 

[bambu]

^^^^ Again, an intoxicant is a substance that is poisonous when ingested.

So anyone making this claim is either misinformed or bearing false witness......

YOUR SMOKING IT !! DO YOU THINK SMOKING IS HEALTHY???? it is polluting your body !! its makrooh !!! it may benefit when not being smoked ! or perhaps vaporized

Or ingested.....

Thank you for the clarity brother....

 

[lostsamuraisotaku]

^^^^ Again, an intoxicant is a substance that is poisonous when ingested.

So anyone making this claim is either misinformed or bearing false witness......

YOUR SMOKING IT !! DO YOU THINK SMOKING IS HEALTHY???? it is polluting your body !! its makrooh !!! it may benefit when not being smoked ! or perhaps vaporized

Or ingested.....

Thank you for the clarity brother....

ya habib ! salam u alykum allahu hafiz

 

[lostsamuraisotaku]

wa khaliqona wa raziqona wa huwa ala kuli shain qadeer

 

[husnain1]

salam u alykum wa ramatulahi wa barakatuhu

the short answer ( iwill answer this a second time later) is that the quran of the prophet ( s.a.w ) is not the quran you read today the ayatollah's still have the hidden quran hidden amongst the wise men the quran you see today was written by the companion uthman by in which the other companions by in large rejected (for a number of reasons)

those are blatant lies. Usman (r.a.) didnt write the Quran he only arranged the verses (that were already in existence) in the order they are in the Quran. In short, he gave "structure" to the Quran.

 

[husnain1]

Why do Muslims claim that Muhammad couldn't write or read (insinuating that for this reason, Allah could be the only author responsible) when everyone understands that the Quran was passed down orally from Muhammad and was not written down until after his death by followers who remembered the lessons?

That is absolutely false. The Quran WAS being written down as it was being revealed to the Prophet (saw). The Prophet (saw) had two scribes (I can post their names if u want more info) who were with him at all times who wrote down the verses as they were being revealed to the Prophet (saw). The oral tradition of the Quran is true yet it is just another way to solidify the accuracy of it.

 

[husnain1]

I got 2 questions. And by no means is this an attack of any kind. Just questions.

1. If Muhammad was truly a man god, then why was he married to a child ( Aisha) when she 6 years old and consummated the marriage when she was 9?

2. Why is slavery and sex slavery allowed?

There are some other questions I have, but these were the first off the top of my head

Peace

1) that is taken from a hadith (that some consider weak). other hadiths put the age of Aisha (r.a.) around 19/20 at the time of marriage/consummation. Hadiths that were on matters of faith tended to be scrutinized more thoroughly while hadith on other issues were not (however were still included amongst the hadiths if there was some reliable chain of narrators).

2) slavery is NOT allowed (there are numerous Quranic and Prophetic injunctions that call for freeing of slaves). however, slavery was a prevalent practice in the world at the time. in order to remove it one has to look at it from the perspective of God's wisdom. The best way to get rid of an action is to work to remove that ideology from the hearts of its believers. In essence the Quran called for the freeing of slaves but to implement this ideology it started by granting unheard of rights to slaves. For example, if one had a slave the slave was to be treated as an equal (given the same food as its "owner," provided with the same level of clothing, etc). Basically in order to get rid of slavery the Quran (through God's wisdom) sought to humanize the slaves. If you were taught to love your fellow man as an equal how could you envision enslaving them?

 

[husnain1]

Welcome back from your incarceration brother.....

Any mention of cannabis in the Qur'an?

salam u alykum wa ramatulahi wa barakatuhu

smoking and devouring strong drink is makrooh according to the sunnah

"Khamr" is what befogs the mind

The Messenger of Allah (Allah bless him & give him peace) said: “Every intoxicant is prohibited.” Sahih al-Bukhari, no. 4088)

And he (Allah bless him & give him peace) also said:

“That which intoxicates in large quantities is prohibited in small quantities.” (Abu Dawud, Tirmidhi, Ibn Majah, and others, with a sound chain of narrators)

insha this helps

Indeed.....

However, the word used in the Koran itself is khamr - which means "fermented grape" - and this classification doesn't cover the use of cannabis....

Islam has generally condemned the use of marijuana; the religion regards the use of any intoxicants as haraam. Sufism (the mystical offshoot of Islam) takes a somewhat different view. This religion believes in knowing God through ecstatic states of mind, and widespread history of marijuana use has been recorded in Sufi culture over the centuries. Indeed, in one Persian folk tale, the founder of Sufism, a monk called Haydar, was the first Persian to discover marijuana. Out walking in the midst of a depressed mood, he came across the marijuana plant and ate several of its leaves. Finding his mood immediately and dramatically improved, he returned to the monastery and recommended that his brother monks should try it too!

helal ottur, gunah yoktur

this is categorically untrue. true sufism follows the sunnah and therefore would absolutely prohibit any use of intoxicants. the first sufi was not a monk called haydar. Sufism's roots go back to the time of the Prophet (saw).

 

[husnain1]

^^^^ Again, an intoxicant is a substance that is poisonous when ingested.

So anyone making this claim is either misinformed or bearing false witness......

you are TOTALLY misunderstanding what meaning of intoxicant is being used here. As far as islam is concerned anything that affects your state of mind (especially in terms of praying) is haram. Marijuana alters your mind state and therefore one would NOT be able to offer salah (prayers).

 

[lostsamuraisotaku]

salam u alykum wa ramatulahi wa barakatuhu

the short answer ( iwill answer this a second time later) is that the quran of the prophet ( s.a.w ) is not the quran you read today the ayatollah's still have the hidden quran hidden amongst the wise men the quran you see today was written by the companion uthman by in which the other companions by in large rejected (for a number of reasons)

those are blatant lies. Usman (r.a.) didnt write the Quran he only arranged the verses (that were already in existence) in the order they are in the Quran. In short, he gave "structure" to the Quran.

as salam u alykum wa ramatulahi wa barakatuhu

thank you for your comment ta barak allah feek

 

[lostsamuraisotaku]

Welcome back from your incarceration brother.....

Any mention of cannabis in the Qur'an?

salam u alykum wa ramatulahi wa barakatuhu

smoking and devouring strong drink is makrooh according to the sunnah

"Khamr" is what befogs the mind

The Messenger of Allah (Allah bless him & give him peace) said: “Every intoxicant is prohibited.” Sahih al-Bukhari, no. 4088)

And he (Allah bless him & give him peace) also said:

“That which intoxicates in large quantities is prohibited in small quantities.” (Abu Dawud, Tirmidhi, Ibn Majah, and others, with a sound chain of narrators)

insha this helps

Indeed.....

However, the word used in the Koran itself is khamr - which means "fermented grape" - and this classification doesn't cover the use of cannabis....

Islam has generally condemned the use of marijuana; the religion regards the use of any intoxicants as haraam. Sufism (the mystical offshoot of Islam) takes a somewhat different view. This religion believes in knowing God through ecstatic states of mind, and widespread history of marijuana use has been recorded in Sufi culture over the centuries. Indeed, in one Persian folk tale, the founder of Sufism, a monk called Haydar, was the first Persian to discover marijuana. Out walking in the midst of a depressed mood, he came across the marijuana plant and ate several of its leaves. Finding his mood immediately and dramatically improved, he returned to the monastery and recommended that his brother monks should try it too!

helal ottur, gunah yoktur

this is categorically untrue. true sufism follows the sunnah and therefore would absolutely prohibit any use of intoxicants. the first sufi was not a monk called haydar. Sufism's roots go back to the time of the Prophet (saw).

^^ attributing sufi'ism to persians is as egregious as it sounds

 

[bambu]

^^^^ Again, an intoxicant is a substance that is poisonous when ingested.

So anyone making this claim is either misinformed or bearing false witness......

you are TOTALLY misunderstanding what meaning of intoxicant is being used here. As far as islam is concerned anything that affects your state of mind (especially in terms of praying) is haram. Marijuana alters your mind state and therefore one would NOT be able to offer salah (prayers).

@husnain1.....

I think that as far as Islam is concerned, cannabis is misunderstood.....

intoxicant =

1. anything that causes intoxication

— adj

2. causing intoxication

***pretty vague***

intoxicate =

1. (of an alcoholic drink) to produce in (a person) a state ranging from euphoria to stupor, usually accompanied by loss of inhibitions and control; make drunk; inebriate

2. to stimulate, excite, or elate so as to overwhelm

3. (of a drug) to poison

Etymology...

intoxicant (n.)

"liquor," 1863; see intoxicate......to poison," mid-15c., from M.L. intoxicatus, pp. of intoxicare "to poison," from L. in- "in" (see in- (2)) + toxicare "to poison," from toxicum "poison" (see toxic). Meaning "make drunk" first recorded 1570s. Related: Intoxicated; intoxicating.

.

helal ottur, gunah yoktur

 

[bambu]

Welcome back from your incarceration brother.....

Any mention of cannabis in the Qur'an?

salam u alykum wa ramatulahi wa barakatuhu

smoking and devouring strong drink is makrooh according to the sunnah

"Khamr" is what befogs the mind

The Messenger of Allah (Allah bless him & give him peace) said: “Every intoxicant is prohibited.” Sahih al-Bukhari, no. 4088)

And he (Allah bless him & give him peace) also said:

“That which intoxicates in large quantities is prohibited in small quantities.” (Abu Dawud, Tirmidhi, Ibn Majah, and others, with a sound chain of narrators)

insha this helps

Indeed.....

However, the word used in the Koran itself is khamr - which means "fermented grape" - and this classification doesn't cover the use of cannabis....

Islam has generally condemned the use of marijuana; the religion regards the use of any intoxicants as haraam. Sufism (the mystical offshoot of Islam) takes a somewhat different view. This religion believes in knowing God through ecstatic states of mind, and widespread history of marijuana use has been recorded in Sufi culture over the centuries. Indeed, in one Persian folk tale, the founder of Sufism, a monk called Haydar, was the first Persian to discover marijuana. Out walking in the midst of a depressed mood, he came across the marijuana plant and ate several of its leaves. Finding his mood immediately and dramatically improved, he returned to the monastery and recommended that his brother monks should try it too!

helal ottur, gunah yoktur

this is categorically untrue. true sufism follows the sunnah and therefore would absolutely prohibit any use of intoxicants. the first sufi was not a monk called haydar. Sufism's roots go back to the time of the Prophet (saw).

Ok...

Indeed, in one Persian folk tale, the founder of Sufism, a monk called Haydar, was the first Persian to discover marijuana. [/b]Out walking in the midst of a depressed mood, he came across the marijuana plant and ate several of its leaves. Finding his mood immediately and dramatically improved, he returned to the monastery and recommended that his brother monks should try it too!

 

[husnain1]

^^^^ Again, an intoxicant is a substance that is poisonous when ingested.

So anyone making this claim is either misinformed or bearing false witness......

you are TOTALLY misunderstanding what meaning of intoxicant is being used here. As far as islam is concerned anything that affects your state of mind (especially in terms of praying) is haram. Marijuana alters your mind state and therefore one would NOT be able to offer salah (prayers).

@husnain1.....

I think that as far as Islam is concerned, cannabis is misunderstood.....

intoxicant =

1. anything that causes intoxication

— adj

2. causing intoxication

***pretty vague***

intoxicate =

1. (of an alcoholic drink) to produce in (a person) a state ranging from euphoria to stupor, usually accompanied by loss of inhibitions and control; make drunk; inebriate

2. to stimulate, excite, or elate so as to overwhelm

3. (of a drug) to poison

Etymology...

intoxicant (n.)

"liquor," 1863; see intoxicate......to poison," mid-15c., from M.L. intoxicatus, pp. of intoxicare "to poison," from L. in- "in" (see in- (2)) + toxicare "to poison," from toxicum "poison" (see toxic). Meaning "make drunk" first recorded 1570s. Related: Intoxicated; intoxicating.

.

helal ottur, gunah yoktur

the problem is you don't have the proper understanding of islam. cannabis is NOT misunderstood. maybe intoxicant is the wrong word being used here. however, the injunction on marijuana is not because it is considered an intoxicant. the problem here is that another poster classified marijuana as an intoxicant and you assumed islam prohibits it based on that classification. that is not the case. it is prohibited based on qiyas (duduction by analogy based on islamic principles). what i said earlier was that you were misinterpreting the meaning of intoxicant in this case. it wasnt being used in its strict medical sense but instead to provide an analogy to point to its mind altering affects which go against islam and therefore is one reason for marijuana being haram (i.e. prohibited)

 

[husnain1]

Welcome back from your incarceration brother.....

Any mention of cannabis in the Qur'an?

salam u alykum wa ramatulahi wa barakatuhu

smoking and devouring strong drink is makrooh according to the sunnah

"Khamr" is what befogs the mind

The Messenger of Allah (Allah bless him & give him peace) said: “Every intoxicant is prohibited.” Sahih al-Bukhari, no. 4088)

And he (Allah bless him & give him peace) also said:

“That which intoxicates in large quantities is prohibited in small quantities.” (Abu Dawud, Tirmidhi, Ibn Majah, and others, with a sound chain of narrators)

insha this helps

Indeed.....

However, the word used in the Koran itself is khamr - which means "fermented grape" - and this classification doesn't cover the use of cannabis....

Islam has generally condemned the use of marijuana; the religion regards the use of any intoxicants as haraam. Sufism (the mystical offshoot of Islam) takes a somewhat different view. This religion believes in knowing God through ecstatic states of mind, and widespread history of marijuana use has been recorded in Sufi culture over the centuries. Indeed, in one Persian folk tale, the founder of Sufism, a monk called Haydar, was the first Persian to discover marijuana. Out walking in the midst of a depressed mood, he came across the marijuana plant and ate several of its leaves. Finding his mood immediately and dramatically improved, he returned to the monastery and recommended that his brother monks should try it too!

helal ottur, gunah yoktur

this is categorically untrue. true sufism follows the sunnah and therefore would absolutely prohibit any use of intoxicants. the first sufi was not a monk called haydar. Sufism's roots go back to the time of the Prophet (saw).

Ok...

Indeed, in one Persian folk tale, the founder of Sufism, a monk called Haydar, was the first Persian to discover marijuana. [/b]Out walking in the midst of a depressed mood, he came across the marijuana plant and ate several of its leaves. Finding his mood immediately and dramatically improved, he returned to the monastery and recommended that his brother monks should try it too!

Welcome back from your incarceration brother.....

Any mention of cannabis in the Qur'an?

salam u alykum wa ramatulahi wa barakatuhu

smoking and devouring strong drink is makrooh according to the sunnah

"Khamr" is what befogs the mind

The Messenger of Allah (Allah bless him & give him peace) said: “Every intoxicant is prohibited.” Sahih al-Bukhari, no. 4088)

And he (Allah bless him & give him peace) also said:

“That which intoxicates in large quantities is prohibited in small quantities.” (Abu Dawud, Tirmidhi, Ibn Majah, and others, with a sound chain of narrators)

insha this helps

Indeed.....

However, the word used in the Koran itself is khamr - which means "fermented grape" - and this classification doesn't cover the use of cannabis....

Islam has generally condemned the use of marijuana; the religion regards the use of any intoxicants as haraam. Sufism (the mystical offshoot of Islam) takes a somewhat different view. This religion believes in knowing God through ecstatic states of mind, and widespread history of marijuana use has been recorded in Sufi culture over the centuries. Indeed, in one Persian folk tale, the founder of Sufism, a monk called Haydar, was the first Persian to discover marijuana. Out walking in the midst of a depressed mood, he came across the marijuana plant and ate several of its leaves. Finding his mood immediately and dramatically improved, he returned to the monastery and recommended that his brother monks should try it too!

helal ottur, gunah yoktur

this is categorically untrue. true sufism follows the sunnah and therefore would absolutely prohibit any use of intoxicants. the first sufi was not a monk called haydar. Sufism's roots go back to the time of the Prophet (saw).

Ok...

Indeed, in one Persian folk tale, the founder of Sufism, a monk called Haydar, was the first Persian to discover marijuana. [/b]Out walking in the midst of a depressed mood, he came across the marijuana plant and ate several of its leaves. Finding his mood immediately and dramatically improved, he returned to the monastery and recommended that his brother monks should try it too!

a folk tale is a folk tale. the point was that he was not the founder of sufism and the folk tale (of which i cant find much evidence for) states he was a founder of a sufi order (these are two different things). by any token if the folk tale is true he was partaking in something that is islamically prohibited. so regardless of whether this story is true this "sufi" smoking weed doesnt give credence to marijuana being lawful (islamically)

 

[bambu]

the problem is you don't have the proper understanding of islam. cannabis is NOT misunderstood. maybe intoxicant is the wrong word being used here. however, the injunction on marijuana is not because it is considered an intoxicant. the problem here is that another poster classified marijuana as an intoxicant and you assumed islam prohibits it based on that classification. that is not the case. it is prohibited based on qiyas (duduction by analogy based on islamic principles). what i said earlier was that you were misinterpreting the meaning of intoxicant in this case. it wasnt being used in its strict medical sense but instead to provide an analogy to point to its mind altering affects which go against islam and therefore is one reason for marijuana being haram (i.e. prohibited)

I can agree with that...

However, the "intoxicant" issue arose out of the incorrect classification of cannabis as Khamr......

Whatever you call it, I think that the effects of cannabis are more mind opening than mind altering.....

a folk tale is a folk tale. the point was that he was not the founder of sufism and the folk tale (of which i cant find much evidence for) states he was a founder of a sufi order (these are two different things). by any token if the folk tale is true he was partaking in something that is islamically prohibited. so regardless of whether this story is true this "sufi" smoking weed doesnt give credence to marijuana being lawful (islamically)

No doubt....

I added the folk tale as "evidence" of cannabis use in Persian/Islamic history......

Not claiming it as the "truth" or a law.......

HOTEP.......

 

[lostsamuraisotaku]

more context on the lies of aisha bint abu bakr

 

[lostsamuraisotaku]

salam u alykum wa ramatulahi wa barakatuhu

the short answer ( iwill answer this a second time later) is that the quran of the prophet ( s.a.w ) is not the quran you read today the ayatollah's still have the hidden quran hidden amongst the wise men the quran you see today was written by the companion uthman by in which the other companions by in large rejected (for a number of reasons)

those are blatant lies. Usman (r.a.) didnt write the Quran he only arranged the verses (that were already in existence) in the order they are in the Quran. In short, he gave "structure" to the Quran.

you cant prove this ^^^ however to render context i will say perhaps "wrote" was a little strong perhaps prepared is the word (kalima ) however the focal point of the caveat is that many did not agree on its publishing to some greater or lesser extent insha this helps