Questions and Statements about God...

[Chike]

Jeremiah 45

"1 The word that Jeremiah the prophet spake unto Baruch the son of Neriah, when he had written these words in a book at the mouth of Jeremiah, in the fourth year of Jehoiakim the son of Josiah king of Judah, saying, 2 Thus saith the LORD, the God of Israel, unto thee, O Baruch: 3 Thou didst say, Woe is me now! for the LORD hath added grief to my sorrow; I fainted in my sighing, and I find no rest. 4 Thus shalt thou say unto him, The LORD saith thus; Behold, that which I have built will I break down, and that which I have planted I will pluck up, even this whole land. 5 And seekest thou great things for thyself? seek them not: for, behold, I will bring evil upon all flesh, saith the LORD: but thy life will I give unto thee for a prey in all places whither thou goest."

God was speaking to me through this passage of scripture last night. There is a lot going in this passage of scripture, but the main key I want to point out is verse 4. God has built America into a great and mighty nation. God has planted this nation to be a light unto the world. No where on planet earth has a country been given so much prosperity and freedom than in the United States of America. And basically God was telling me that the time is near for God to judge this land. What God has built, He will break down and what God has planted, He will pluck up, EVEN THIS WHOLE ENTIRE LAND. America is in for a rude awakening. Judgment is fast approaching.

God also told me that the attack on Israel is coming soon. When? I don't know. But God said in His word that every nation will turn it's back on Israel in the last days, which even means the United States, who is Israel closest ally. One of the main reasons why God has yet to judge America, even though our cup of judgment has been filled to the brim, is because we support Israel. God is true to His word and He said it all the way back in Genesis 12:2-3, "And I will make of thee a great nation, and I will bless thee, and make thy name great; and thou shalt be a blessing: 3 And I will bless them that bless thee, and curse him that curseth thee: and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed." God continues to bless America because we stand with Israel, but this relationship will be broken in the future and when that happens judgment will come fast and hard upon America.

Just some food for thought.

Bro, you think God is on America's side? lol This is Satan's empire and you think God is the reason America has flourished? LOL Now I know you're crazy. The reason this Nation is so powerful and so-called prosperous is because the people responsible for creating and maintaining it had sold their souls to Satan himself and in return, Satan had kept his end of the bargain by giving them a false sense of heaven, aka Materialistic wealth while the nation and any other nation that had followed the western civilized way of life Wreaks havoc upon the earth and destroys the very living conditions it needs to sustain life. My whole satan god reference in this post is all symbolic, not literal, but it's the only way a sheeple like you would understand what I'm getting at. When "God" comes back and judges America, he's going to obliderate it off the face of the planet and there will be no historical evidence left to even hint that it ever existed... Noone in America, who is a patriot, is free, mentally, and if you're not free mentally, you're not free physically. Control the mind and the body will follow. They got their life stock living in shit hole ghettos and working the worst shitty ass jobs if at all, killing themselves, and lining them up against the wall to throw into a prison for free labor, aka modern day chattel slavery over silly ass reasons such as possession of a fucking plant. There is nothing righteous about this Country or civilization in general... I can't believe Christians call themselves followers of Christ and then salute the fucking flag of Satan's Kingdom.... it's absurd.

 

[ThaChozenWun]

now if you have some other wars that you think similar things about, i'm willing to consider your arguments for them.

Wars from Christianity

The Crusades- http://history-world.org/crusades.htm

french wars of religion - http://www.lepg.org/wars.htm

The thirty years war (European Wars of religion) - http://www.wsu.edu/~dee/REFORM/WARS.HTM

Taiping Rebellion - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taiping_Rebellion

Martin Luther (Peasant’s revolt - 1524) - http://www.newworldencyclopedia.org/entry/German_Peasants'_revolt

The Moorish Invasion

The Reconquista - Spain was taken back through war in the attempt to recalim christianity as its main religion

Rotuma's war (again taking over a place to push in christian views.) - http://www.rotuma.net/os/howsel/22religiouswars.html

With Islam it is considered a holy war thats all you got say, Jihad is a holy war which means if they go to war they are doing it based on their religion

The whole Israel-Palestinian war - its over land yes but without religion this land would not be fought over constantly.

Judaism

War of extermination against the Amalekites - http://www.jewishencyclopedia.com/view.jsp?artid=1351&letter=A

Catholics v Protestants:

-Spanish v Dutch (kicked off 1566 but really got underway 1576-1648),

-Spanish v English (1585-1588 + Armada + much raiding),

-French v French (wow! a guaranteed French win! Persecution of Huguenots early 1500's till 1789),

-Glasgow Rangers v Glasgow Celtic (every year since 1888)

Great article on the many civil wars brought forth on religious basis - http://newsblaze.com/story/20081130140511krzy.nb/topstory.html

I'll list more after you study them and we can discuss these if you disagree

 

[kingblaze84]

Powerful movie clip.....I truly wonder how "good" a God we have that also created earthquakes and cancer. Seems very weird to me.

 

[kingblaze84]

So - you may be asking, "So I believe in the Bible. What's the big deal? Why do you care if I want to waste my life pursuing insanity?" Yes - that is a strong point generally. The right to be wrong is one of the core principles of the people because we often make a lot of mistakes on the path to discovering the truth. But - when a group of people threaten the well being of others then that's a different story.

In particular - Christians believe in the Apocalypse, or the end of the world. And - because it's important to them that they not be wrong = some of them are working towards making the world actually end. Others are just irresponsible and think that it doesn't matter how bad they mess things up because God will fix it and forgive them. That causes them to be irresponsible for their behavior and dangerous to society.

Faith in God is a dangerous thing. On September 11th 2001 a group of Muslims, acting in behalf of God, hijacked 4 planes and crashed them into buildings killing over 3000 people. The reason these people did it was because they believed they were acting in behalf of God and that God will reward them by giving them 70 virgins to have sex with for eternity. The fact is that these mass murderers are not in Heaven and that they are not having sex with 70 virgins. They are dead along with their victims. Why did this happen? Because they had faith! And as a result of their faith the world is a more dangerous place. Now Christians are seeing this as an opportunity to use their influence in the American administration to not only wage a war to kill a bunch of Muslims, but to take control of the world and impose God's laws (or rather what they believe are God's laws) on the rest of us by force.

Twenty years ago America had a Secretary of the Interior named James Watt. Watt was actually pro-pollution and his excuse was that it didn't matter what we did to the environment - Jesus was coming back soon to destroy the Earth. Jesus is dead - if he ever existed at all - and he is not coming back. But - people who believe he is coming are much more likely to destroy the Earth and use God as an excuse to make it happen. If religious fanatics get control of weapons of mass destruction they will use them as part of their ritual fantasies. and the rest of us will suffer the consequences.

We live on this small ball of dust and this ball is all we have for now. We have the technology to destroy all life on this planet (well - all life of any complexity anyhow) and this is our home - and it's home to all of us. So if some people believe in the Book of Revelations and use that as a basis or excuse to destroy the home for the whole human race - then they are encroaching on our rights.

Historically religion is the basis for most war. Christians slaughter Muslims, Muslims slaughter Jews, Jews slaughter Palestinians, Catholics slaughter Protestants. They all think that God gave them property. They think they are the "chosen people". And they all think they are acting in behalf of God because God is impotent and incapable of acting on his own behalf, these people have to do God's work for him, which often includes slaughtering the nonbelievers. Nonbelievers like me.

So - because of religion some moron might start a nuclear war or something and wipe out the human race and then this planet just becomes another lifeless piece of dust in the universe. Maybe the cockroaches will take over and become intelligent and form a better society? But - I have to admit that I'm partial to humans - one of my prejudices I suppose. I just think it's a bad idea to annihilate the human race. .

And - it's not just one religion going to war with another. They end up killing a lot of innocent people along the way. And it's all for nothing. People have to die over something that doesn't exist. So - it's not just a bad choice to believe in God - it's a choice that is dangerous to yourself and others. There are however some religions who believe in God and are not a threat to other people and that's much better. But the bottom line in most religions is world domination and I don't want to live in a world dominated by a deity fantasy. I choose to believe in what's real.

You are truly one of the enlightened people posting in this forum. Keep up the great threads.

 

[The GMW]

Well, that's one attitude towards it but it is not what I'm suggesting. Something like rape will never leave a person. They would want justice; they would feel shame and have a lack of trust. The fault comes when we don't attempt to cope with it in a positive way; seek help, find people who share in the same struggle and find a reason to trust again. If possible, seek justice.

I believe everybody worships something. It may not be God and we go to a church to do rituals or something, but it is something that we look to that gives us a sense of identity, a sense of self-worth; something that defines our life (or is life); something that lasts. Some people use a career their "god". Some use financial status. Some use a position of power. Whatever it is, we are looking for something to worship.

Attempting to cope with it is separate from the suffering itself. As you said, something like rape will never leave a person. Regardless of whether the individual makes a proactive effort to cope, the suffering has occurred. Any "positive" effect that results from that is only positive relative to the horror of what has already happened. It will not erase the damage done to the victim. Further, there are those who simply do not have the emotional willpower to rebound from something like that. It's not their "fault", no more than an arachnophobe is at fault for being afraid of spiders. Different people have different emotional/psychological natures.

Apart from that, there is a vast, vast range of types of suffering that occur. We've been discussing isolated tragic incidents in otherwise decent lives. What about things like lifelong chattel slavery? Imprisonment in a concentration camp? Infants that are born into destitution and disease only to starve to death after a few days? Or how about rape victims who contract STDs and die? There is suffering that eliminates the possibility of a positive outcome.

I don't think you addressed the heaven question. I'm curious to know what people in heaven supposedly lack and desire.

 

[Darius]

postin Bible verses, professing your faith, retelling the Easter story that everyone already knows doesn't score you any points. If God is checkin your page then there is a reason you are listed as single w/ 3 kids, no employment status, and a favorite quote as "Imma do me"

log off.

 

[TheGambinoLegacy]

"get on my level ho" > "imma do me"

 

[Darius]

i guess being Easter, people feel compelled to post it. IDK, i put up something about West Virginia coach being a wild homo for violating man laws with his player.

 

[UPTOWN]

come to think of it, im gonna go LOL everyone's status today

 

[Yungin T. Jeezie]

not a easter status but "is loving my life and the people in it....even my haters...KEEP THEM EVEN CLOSER....LMBO..GOODNIGHT FACES"

I stood up all night without sleep to search the humor in that status

 

[bless the child]

this is my status

i ondt ckfu wthi rackca susej

 

[alissowack]

Attempting to cope with it is separate from the suffering itself. As you said, something like rape will never leave a person. Regardless of whether the individual makes a proactive effort to cope, the suffering has occurred. Any "positive" effect that results from that is only positive relative to the horror of what has already happened. It will not erase the damage done to the victim. Further, there are those who simply do not have the emotional willpower to rebound from something like that. It's not their "fault", no more than an arachnophobe is at fault for being afraid of spiders. Different people have different emotional/psychological natures.

Apart from that, there is a vast, vast range of types of suffering that occur. We've been discussing isolated tragic incidents in otherwise decent lives. What about things like lifelong chattel slavery? Imprisonment in a concentration camp? Infants that are born into destitution and disease only to starve to death after a few days? Or how about rape victims who contract STDs and die? There is suffering that eliminates the possibility of a positive outcome.

I don't think you addressed the heaven question. I'm curious to know what people in heaven supposedly lack and desire.

If suffering is inevitable, does it means that it robs you of choice? God or no God, you are still left with a choice on how you deal with it. It's unfortunate that there have been people who have gone through slavery or concentration camps that were never going to see the light of day; they will die in those circumstances. But does mean they couldn't have done something about it? They had a choice to try to free themselves or stay in bondage. Sure there is the risk of being caught or killed of trying to escape, but the option was still there...and people had made that choice. We are at fault if our choice is to accept what is wrong even if we are essentially born into what is wrong. We ought to want what is right...even if means risking our lives. However, who would do such a thing willingly? What hope is there is in trying to have freedom if we may die in trying to attain it? We will choose what is wrong if it let us "live" a little while longer.

In Heaven, desire won't end because God is the source of our desires. The desire for God will last eternally.

 

[ItzGravitation]

wtf you talkin bout dude

 

[ThaChozenWun]

Reread it..................................................

I dont think he knows what Moses was told.

 

[ItzGravitation]

i know but i dont know

give me a quot/verse to refresh my memory

 

[The GMW]

If suffering is inevitable, does it means that it robs you of choice? God or no God, you are still left with a choice on how you deal with it. It's unfortunate that there have been people who have gone through slavery or concentration camps that were never going to see the light of day; they will die in those circumstances. But does mean they couldn't have done something about it? They had a choice to try to free themselves or stay in bondage. Sure there is the risk of being caught or killed of trying to escape, but the option was still there...and people had made that choice. We are at fault if our choice is to accept what is wrong even if we are essentially born into what is wrong. We ought to want what is right...even if means risking our lives. However, who would do such a thing willingly? What hope is there is in trying to have freedom if we may die in trying to attain it? We will choose what is wrong if it let us "live" a little while longer.

In Heaven, desire won't end because God is the source of our desires. The desire for God will last eternally.

No, in most cases they could not have done anything about it. First off, only a certain segment of slaves/concentration camp prisoners (namely young and physically fit adults) would have even a remote chance of escape. Someone who is elderly, or has been beaten/tortured to the point of physical disability would truly not stand a chance of escape, and so there is absolutely nothing they can do about their suffering. Also, in concentration camps, I believe that every time a prisoner successfully escaped, the guards would randomly choose 10 other prisoners and starve them to death. Knowing that, would you still consider attempting escape to be some kind of ethical requirement?

Further, you're arguing for a "compassionate" god that allows people to be imprisoned in death camps or enslaved, and then demands that they risk their lives by trying to escape, or else they are somehow morally in the wrong? Does that seem reasonable to you? And then there are infants born in third-world countries, who live brief lives knowing nothing but the agony of disease and starvation. They are only born to suffer; there is no "choice" involved in their plight.

 

[janklow]

The Crusades- http://history-world.org/crusades.htm

definitely about money. now i will grant you that a lot of people fought IN the wars because they had legitimate religious reason to do so, and the wars were very clearly framed as religious ones, but were they more about "converting heathens/expanding Christendom" or "taking back some shit that should have been ours"

french wars of religion - http://www.lepg.org/wars.htm

consolidation of power, not religion. look at Northern Ireland; religion clearly flavors the conflict, but it's still more about "who should own this shit"

The thirty years war (European Wars of religion) - http://www.wsu.edu/~dee/REFORM/WARS.HTM

to quote the link you gave, "it is fair to say, however, that this war was as much about politics as it was about religion." exactly.

Taiping Rebellion - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taiping_Rebellion

hmmm... a good choice because the key figure was SO crazy-religious, but i'm still thinking this was mostly about social change (beyond religion) against the ruling dynasty.

Martin Luther (Peasant’s revolt - 1524) - http://www.newworldencyclopedia.org/entry/German_Peasants'_revolt

again, your link: "although sparked by the Protestant Reformation, it was motivated largely by social discontent as the result of increasing economic inequality at a time when the feudal system was coming unraveled." economics strike again.

The Moorish Invasion/The Reconquista - Spain was taken back through war in the attempt to recalim christianity as its main religion

i don't think the Moors invaded to spread Islam and i don't think the Spanish had solely religious motives for trying to get their shit back.

Rotuma's war (again taking over a place to push in christian views.) - http://www.rotuma.net/os/howsel/22religiouswars.html

i suppose i don't think the REAL reason you take over a place is "to push in Christian views"

With Islam it is considered a holy war thats all you got say, Jihad is a holy war which means if they go to war they are doing it based on their religion

saying that doesn't mean that's why you're fighting the war. that's where i have been going with all this.

The whole Israel-Palestinian war - its over land yes but without religion this land would not be fought over constantly.

disagree. it's over land. if there wasn't the land dispute, the religious difference wouldn't really matter.

War of extermination against the Amalekites - http://www.jewishencyclopedia.com/view.jsp?artid=1351&letter=A

how literally am i supposed to take this part of the Bible?

Catholics v Protestants:
-Spanish v Dutch (kicked off 1566 but really got underway 1576-1648),
-Spanish v English (1585-1588 + Armada + much raiding),
-French v French (wow! a guaranteed French win! Persecution of Huguenots early 1500's till 1789),
-Glasgow Rangers v Glasgow Celtic (every year since 1888)

at the risk of sounding flip, i think a bunch of this got discussed

 

[tri3w]

\Why would we speak about religion at dinner when life is much more than a book?

I do think hiphop has alot to do with it. They have put an image into the youths brain that gangbangin. fuckin mad bitches, sellin dope, and killin niggas is the normal. Im sorry but anyone who thinks hiphop hasnt effected the way todays youth acts are lost in fantasy worlds and must think no one is responsible for the world that sorrounds you.

From when I grew up until now (the time hiphop really took off) shit done changed to somethin thousands of time worst than it was. When I was young people wanted out of poverty and gang violence, kids now want to glorify it and make sure it happens

but this is the probelm with that.............We been doin that waaaaaaaaaaaay b4 hiphop Came on the Scene; Drugs, sellling it, Shootin, all the time............I think music Affects people all the time but to Blame it as the Singular source of societies ills and missteps is kinda crazy..........i think people Who really dont understand the music and where is Coming from makes statments like that, sorta like With u and religon, i Dont think ur Truely Grasp the Concept, which is cool, to each is thier own (I think U tried to however at some poin in ur life but thats 4 a different thread lol). u cant really make General Statements like that about it being the Source of Socities woes..........i still believe its the person

 

[TX_Made713]

im confused.....

 

[TX_Made713]

Thats the just of most responses on this board....Blacks are righteous and woman have no role in anything biblical

when peopl wrote about the men (matthew,mark,etc) and gave them their own books why wasnt there a womans book? mary magdalane had a lost gospel that was deemed unworthy of the bible why was that inspired?