If the Sun creates life then...

[Jabu_Rule]

Well since everything is energy, and we know energy isn't "dead" or it wouldn't exist, it could be said all things are "alive" and have existence. I realize you want to keep all things in their right boxes and nicely labeled, but its all still the same old thing, ever changing lively energy.

Energy is just that. Life takes a combination of energy formed into matter creating structures that are able to reproduce, adapt and pass inheritance. That is the definition of life. You just want to give everything and anything that definition.

The definition of being alive is particular. If you want to give a name to the fact that everything is created from a substructure of energy, then be my guess. I guess a house is an orange now.

 

[UPTOWN]

No, it doesn't satisfy the basic requirements to be considered "alive"; reproduction/evolution, homeostasis, metabolization, responding to stimuli, etc.

Just because a chemical reaction occurs within something and produces something doesn't mean it's alive.

but the sun will "live" much longer than you and i, so how do you know it wont reproduce?? who cares what scientists "think" will happen when the sun "burns out"

 

[BiblicalAtheist]

Energy is just that. Life takes a combination of energy formed into matter creating structures that are able to reproduce, adapt and pass inheritance.

Right, that is what we have concluded some forms of energy do. Other forms do not do this same thing.

That is the definition of life.

Right, but it's still fundamentally energy.

You just want to give everything and anything that definition.

Correct, I want all things labeled as they truly are, energy, no matter which category they are segregated into.

The definition of being alive is particular.

Because it helps us categorize the different forms of the same substance.

If you want to give a name to the fact that everything is created from a substructure of energy, then be my guess.

Just calling it what it is.

I guess a house is an orange now.

Different labels for the same thing, energy, just in different forms and we point them out and label them. But thanks for the smartass-ism.

 

[Jabu_Rule]

Right, that is what we have concluded some forms of energy do. Other forms do not do this same thing.

Right, but it's still fundamentally energy.

Correct, I want all things labeled as they truly are, energy, no matter which category they are segregated into.

Because it helps us categorize the different forms of the same substance.

Just calling it what it is.

Different labels for the same thing, energy, just in different forms and we point them out and label them. But thanks for the smartass-ism.

Ok then you go on and have your energy drink and I'll go on naming structures that i actually interact with.

 

[perspective@100]

realistically... all reasonable responses to this thread shouldve ended right here

Actually if you were never open to someone elses "thinking" you should have stopped reading here:

is the sun itself "alive"?

Just something I've been thinking about...

 

[b*braze]

Actually if you were never open to someone elses "thinking" you should have stopped reading here:

actually i came in with an open mind to see what you had here (which turned out to be nothing more than your own thoughts and ruminations) but when presented with facts you dismissed them as bullshit because one day you just woke up like this is all bullshit and no one could tell you different.

 

[BiblicalAtheist]

I'll go on naming

And that's all it ever was or is.... naming. And if it makes your world make more sense, then have at 'er.

 

[BiblicalAtheist]

actually i came in with an open mind to see what you had here (which turned out to be nothing more than your own thoughts and ruminations) but when presented with facts you dismissed them as bullshit because one day you just woke up like this is all bullshit and no one could tell you different.

Oh so you were only interesting in his thoughts if they were in alignment with facts, so you weren't really opened minded, because you were closed minded to anything other than facts?

 

[Jabu_Rule]

And that's all it ever was or is.... naming. And if it makes your world make more sense, then have at 'er.

Things are named for their particular observable characteristics. You have no have no proof of any underlining characteristic that constitutes life existing within energy without mass. We're not supposed to categorize structures created to be so very different because their built on an underlying connection? So a computer program isn't different from another because it's in the same computer right? The code is all the same correct? All code holds the same complexity you say.

You are the one obsessed with names. Your obsession comes from making up your own definitions based on fantasy characteristics that no one knows to be true. We give things names based on their interactions no matter the underlining effect. Complex interactions can produce complex organisms that reproduce. This is what we call life or more accurately life FORMS. That is all.

It isn't as philosophical as you pretend. If we find that to be the case in pure energy then I'm with you. The names we use are based on the overlaying complexity that we are aware of and directly interface with as humans no matter how abstract the world is. You wanna live in pure, unstructured energy? You can try. Let us know how it worked out.

 

[b*braze]

Oh so you were only interesting in his thoughts if they were in alignment with facts, so you weren't really opened minded, because you were closed minded to anything other than facts?

no if you read... i said it was him calling the facts bullshit just because, is what caused me to lose interest

since when does open mind = ignoring reality

i can have an open mind to a new idea without totally dismissing what i know is true to be bullshit

 

[BiblicalAtheist]

It isn't as philosophical as you pretend.

Pointing one that all things are energy and that energy is not dead is philosophical.... interesting.

 

[BiblicalAtheist]

no if you read... i said it was him calling the facts bullshit just because, is what caused me to lose interest

since when does open mind = ignoring reality

That was not the structure of your sentence.

Open mind would denote open to all sides, not just factual ones, even if they think facts are bullshit.

 

[Jabu_Rule]

Pointing one that all things are energy and that energy is not dead is philosophical.... interesting.

Pointing out energy to hold the characteristics for what we refer to as life and going off on a tangent about how energy is life is philosophical.

 

[BiblicalAtheist]

Pointing out energy as a characteristic for what we refer to as life and going off on a tangent about how energy is life is philosophical.

No, my point was all things are energy and energy is not dead. You my good Sir, went off on tangents.

 

[Jabu_Rule]

No, my point was all things are energy and energy is not dead. You my good Sir, went off on tangents.

Let me ask you this. What constitutes energy. Why should energy be considered life? I can see energy producing life, but why is it alive?

 

[BiblicalAtheist]

Let me ask you this. What constitutes energy. Why should energy be considered life? I can see energy producing life, but why is it alive?

It is alive in the sense that it is not dead/non existent, as I said earlier. Should it be considered death?

What makes up energy? If you know, please tell me.

Name one thing that isn't a form of energy?

 

[b*braze]

That was not the structure of your sentence.

Open mind would denote open to all sides, not just factual ones, even if they think facts are bullshit.

how so? i said...

actually i came in with an open mind to see what you had here but when presented with facts you dismissed them as bullshit because one day you just woke up like this is all bullshit and no one could tell you different.

like i said... what he believed didnt make or break my opinion on it. it was when he said facts were bullshit just because he said so.

i was fine with him sayin "i think blahzay skippy..." but when he crossed over to "this is what i think and all that other shit is bullshit because i said so even tho you have all this stuff backing up what you and i have nothing but my own thoughts to back me up and no one could tell me different".

 

[kingblaze84]

I'm surprised this thread got so many replies. The sun is NOT a living thing, because it does not show all the signs of a living thing. The sun does not reproduce, and as far as we see, does not seem to want to reproduce with other things. So no, it is not a living thing. The sun helps create life, but so does water and a whole bunch of other stuff. Water isn't a living thing, and neither is oxygen.

 

[kingblaze84]

Energy is just that. Life takes a combination of energy formed into matter creating structures that are able to reproduce, adapt and pass inheritance. That is the definition of life. You just want to give everything and anything that definition.

The definition of being alive is particular. If you want to give a name to the fact that everything is created from a substructure of energy, then be my guess. I guess a house is an orange now.

Good post, you pretty much shut this thread down along with Fiat Money.

 

[BiblicalAtheist]

how so? i said...

like i said... what he believed didnt make or break my opinion on it. it was when he said facts were bullshit just because he said so.

i was fine with him sayin "i think blahzay skippy..." but when he crossed over to "this is what i think and all that other shit is bullshit because i said so even tho you have all this stuff backing up what you and i have nothing but my own thoughts to back me up and no one could tell me different".

Actually this was your response:

actually i came in with an open mind to see what you had here (which turned out to be nothing more than your own thoughts and ruminations) but when presented with facts you dismissed them as bullshit because one day you just woke up like this is all bullshit and no one could tell you different.

You came in to find out what he had, which turned out to be nothing more than his own thoughts.