HIP-HOP 101: GRAND WIZZARD THEODORE (The Inventor of the Scratch)

[waterproof]

TS: So can you remember what the crowd looked like the first day you did the legendary scratch?

GWT: Yo, it was up in 63 park, half a block away from where I lived at. Yeah, people was just so hyped. When I created the scratch it wasn’t like it took three, four weeks for me to actually bring it out to the public, it was like an over night thing. The next time when we came out is when I did it. Everybody was like going crazy, people were saying "Oh s---!" You had some people that stopped dancing and came up to the front by the turntables to see what I was doing, other people were like saying its on.

TS: Other then your Fantastic 5 emcees, who are your top emcees from back then?

GWT: Mele Mel

, Raheim

, Cowboy

.

TS: What you just going to say the Furious 5? (as we laugh.)

GWT: Caz

and J.D.L.

were my next 2 emcees.

TS: Looks like you really just talking about original emcees that Dota Rock would call Masters. As if Grand Master’s in the Karate flicks.Alright what about the 5 best DJs of today, since you have been all around the world, and people respect you I know you have seen a whole lot of DJs come and go.

GWT: Oh man! I have seen a lot of DJs. I would definitely say the X-ecutioners

.

TS: That’s a crew of guys right?

GWT: Yeah, I also say Roc Raida

.

TS: I know him, well not personally, but I have heard of him.

GWT: I would next say DJ Domination.

TS: I don’t know him.

GWT: This guy is really crazy, he is like a DJ exhibitionist. He has a video were he bought his turntables to a basketball court and put his turntables right under the net and hung him self upside down from the net and started DJing upside down. It was crazy.

TS: Damn sure was.

GWT: Then he did a skit with Heather Hunter, were she put her legs around him and her back was to the mixer and he was DJing holding her up like that.

TS: Were is he from?

GWT: Florida.

TS: Who is the other 3?

GWT: I would say this guy named Z-Trip. He will mix Elvis with Run-DMC.

TS: I hear you, and he could make it sound good?

GWT: He would just mix records together that you wouldn’t think mixed. He will mix Rock and Roll, he will mix Motown s--- with Rock records. He will mix everything!

TS: The other 2?

GWT: I would say DJ Q-Bert

.

TS: I heard of him.

GWT: Yeah Q-Bert is bad.

TS: What separated him from the crowd?

GWT: Well basically what he does is use 1 turntable.

TS: What?

GWT: He will play the beat and he will scratch through out his whole routine. If he plays for 2 hours, he will scratch for two hours.

TS: The last one?

GWT: I definitely would say Jam Master Jay

TS: Jam Master Jay. God bless him. So what is your feelings on Kid Capri

and Brucie Bee

?

GWT: Capri and Brucie Bee are definitely on. When Disco King Mario used to live up on the Westside (in the Bronx), in Kid Capri’s block in Sedwick Avenue, Capri used to come in the basement and watch me play.

TS: This was way back, little boy days.

GWT: Yeah, before he even started DJing, he used to come down and watch me play. He said, “I am going to be a DJ one day.” I said, “Well good luck.”

TS: I bring up Capri because you spoke about Z Trip saying how he would rock music that other people wouldn’t think of. Capri is some what the same, I heard him rock Jackson 5 records like no one else, I say that because you grew up hearing Jackson 5 songs all your life, he turned it into an art form, so you continue to appreciate the Jackson 5 music.

 

[waterproof]

GWT: I say Brucie Bee also because they were somewhat the same. They really knew how to rock a party and he was also from the Roof Top and they, along with Kool Kyle, started that mixtape legacy. Brucie Bee played for my birthday party at Willie's in Harlem (which moved across from the old Disco Fever in the Bronx.) He did his thing.

TS: On the subject of the movie Wild Style

, how did you and Charlie Ahearn get so cool, you are still kool with him today?

GWT: Yeah, I still talk to him, his wife and son.

TS: At that time he treated you like family, am I right?

GWT: Yeah! We met Charlie Ahearn through Busy Bee.

TS: And Fab 5 Freddy

?

GWT: Yeah and Fab 5 Freddy. They met Busy Bee, and he used to bring them around to all the parties and stuff like that. Charlie used to take a lot of pictures and stuff like that, then he decided he wanted to make a movie.

TS: Why did he pick you to do the sound track to Wild Style? I know this had to be the first time you or any DJ did something like this. So how did you feel doing this when you were not experienced in this field?

GWT: At that time, I was one of the hottest DJs, and we got pretty close. One day he said, "Since you're doing so many parties and pretty much know what the people want - I don’t want to put none of the original breaks on there, I want to do something totally different." So we went in the studio and I laid down some foundations and they took it from there. I didn’t really just sit in the studio and see the project all the way through, I just laid the foundation down and they did the rest.

TS: I ask you this because my man JayQuan says he really appreciates how you mix the music to the opening scene. It appears the film was already done and then as you are watching it you’re adding the music into it.

GWT: They wanted each scene to have certain music, so what I did was watch each scene. The copies of the soundtrack were already pressed up. I already had two. Basically what I did was watch each scene of the movie and put the music to the scene.

TS: So how did you feel about this music that they presented for you to use?

GWT: At first I wasn’t feeling the music, because I felt they should have used a lot of the original breaks, but Charlie didn’t want to do that because he would have to clear a lot of samples and they were only working with a certain budget. After time went by I started to get a soft spot for the music.

TS: I understand. Why were you picked to do that job instead of Flash, Charlie Chase or Kool Herc or somebody like that, being as they were just as popular as you were and older?

GWT: It probably was the relationship I had with Charlie, we was really close.

TS: Right off the back ya’ll hit it off soon as ya’ll met?

GWT: Yeah. Yeah definitely.

TS: So do you know if Flash was a little slighted since he only had that little piece in his kitchen?

GWT: I think that was the best scene in the movie.

TS: It was real hot, I dug it. but I felt because he was Flash he should have gotten a whole lot more, and why weren’t the Furious 5 involved?

GWT:I really don’t know. I think Busy Bee was the one coaxing Charlie who to put in the movie and who not to put in the movie, I believe.

TS: But Busy was digging the hell out of Furious too, wasn’t he?

GWT: Oh yeah but I think being as Flash and them had their records out, it might have been time to let somebody else get some shine.

TS: How long did it take for them to shoot it?

GWT: Ah man like two years.

TS: Two years? I had no idea. It is not like it is a very long movie.

GWT: What happened was Debra Harry, (Blondie)

and her husband were the ones that financed the movie. He got sick, Chris Stein her husband. He got so sick it was touch and go for a minute. So the funding for the movie had stopped.

TS: (Damn almost didn’t have a Wildstyle.)

GWT: So they put it on hold for like 4 or 5 months then once he got better we resumed with the movie and stuff like that. I feel I should have had more acting parts, but I was pretty much satisfied with what we did.

TS: How did ya’ll fill up that amphitheater?

GWT: Basically what we did was send out flyers.and people are always hanging out at the amphitheater so once they seen the cameras and the people... to be honest, most of those people were people that were just walking by and just walked in off the street. I have to say D.ST had the best part at the end, which is really cool.

 

[Kwan Dai]

Peace. This was a long over due history lesson. Waterproof are these old tapes that have been referrenced during the interview available for purchase, download?

 

[waterproof]

@kwanDai you know what there's was a site few years ago that sold old tapes from the 80's from the Latin Quaters, old school battles and everything from those that was mention in this interview and the early days of hip-hop imcluding som Kool Herc parties, i will have to go search for that site.

but in meantime FOR ALL THE HIP-HOP HEADS im going to drop a thread with links to old school hip-hop tapes for downloads im talking about CASH CREW, COLD CRUSH BROTHERS, GRANDMASTER FLASH, EVERY HIP-HOP LEGEND from the 70's to 80's starting in 1977 or i might dropped in here but i will notify you using the @ to let you know, give me a few minutes

 

[waterproof]

TS: I am going to switch lanes now. What happened in the dispute with Heineken beer?



GWT: People say I was going to sue them, not true. I never really came out and said I am going to sue them. Today we are trying to educate people about the early days of Hip Hop and who were the true players and stuff like that. For Heineken to go and do something like that was out of order. They never called none of the pioneers to come and do any benefits for them. When they do shows, they don’t call Kool Herc or Afrika Bambaataa or Flash or me to come and M.C. the show or open up for anybody. They never did anything like that. Then they did that little spoof commercial. It's really crazy, because how could you do some commercial like that and make money off of us and you not trying to hire us to come down and do anything. Then when I came down to speak to them, they had their little lawyers there, 3 or 4 of them sitting there. So now the reps are saying “Ueah we at Heineken do a lot of things for Hip Hop and stuff like that.” I said, "You guys don’t do nothing for Hip Hop. You guys do things for Rap. You don’t do anything for Hip Hop. I don’t see Bambaataa, Flash, Herc or myself doing any shows." They said “Well we do basketball games for the kids, baseball games for the kids.” I said. "OK, let me get this correct, just to see if we are on the same page here. You mean to tell me you guys do basketball games for kids 9, 10, 11, 12 years old. You do baseball games for little teenagers, and when they come to the park they see a bunch of Heineken signs all around the field, is that what you are trying to tell me? That doesn’t make any sense.

TS: What was their response to that?

GWT: They didn’t know what to say, while I was speaking to them, the lawyers were getting up and walking out one by one, because they knew that my argument was relevant. I said you guys can’t sit here and tell me that you are doing all this stuff for these kids, because when the kids come to the park what they going to see, sponsored by Heineken.

TS: You are exactly right.

GWT: That is bull s---. I don’t want my son coming to the park and he see a bunch of Heineken signs.

TS: (Note: the commercial went like this. The party was rocking and stuff like that and the guy spilled a Heineken bottle on the record then he took a towel and dried off the record while he was drying it, he was mistakenly at first moving the record back and forth, forth and back and it was the scratch. The crowd was going off . It amped the party more. Then the commercial said the scratch started in 1982, another mistake on their part.)

GWT: I just went there to let them acknowledge that they were wrong for what they did, nothing more.

TS: What were the turntables you were using back then and the turntables you are using today.

GWT: We were using Technics back then, the 2300’s. Today you have the pitch control where you push it up or push it down, back then you had the pitch control were you had a little round knob were you twist it. I think they were belt drives back then, today they are direct drives.

TS: All through your history of DJing how many pair of or single turntables have you had?

GWT: Ah man! That’s a good one, I don’t know, probably about 10 pair.

TS: That’s all, 10 pair all your life? So they always go wherever you go?

GWT: Yeah.

TS: So do you ever experiment with the CD turntables?

GWT: Yeah, for sure I have a pair of those as well.

TS: How many crates of records did you have back then, before

Wildstyle?

GWT: Before Wild style I probably had about 60 crates of records.

TS: 60 crates dam! So how many do you have today, combined?

GWT: I stopped counting, at about 210 crates. Something like that.

TS: What are you doing today with yourself?

GWT: I am just traveling, but when I am in town I work at Jam Master Jay's Scratch Academy.

TS: Where exactly is that?

GWT: That is 430 East 9th St and 6th avenue. A block away from Fat Beats record store. (A few more blocks a way from the legendary West 4th basketball courts.)

TS: So who comes in there, young children? College students?

GWT: All kind of people come in there. We did a class were juveniles came in there. We had a class were 80, 90 year old people came in. We had them sitting in chairs scratching. It was a sight. I still travel around the world.

TS: Still doing shows?

GWT: Yeah, I have been to Malaysia, Afghanistan, Spain, London, France.

 

[waterproof]

NAS USED GRAND WIZZARD THEODORE's Subway theme for Illmatics Gensis track

 

[waterproof]

TS: So let me ask you this, when you go into these other countries do you mix their records or you just keep mixing American records? Do you ever mix those European or overseas records for them?

GWT: I always take my records, but I also have their records as well. Each time I go there I have DJs that give me records, I go to the record shops there and shop for records, so when I go back there I will have their kind of music, and mix it in with my music.

TS: So you have found dope beats at say Afghanistan or Spain?

GWT: Oh yeah.

TS: And rock it together in another language and all that?

GWT: Yeah man.

TS: Damn, that’s very interesting. I know pretty much what’s up with the whole crew, but what in the world is up with Ruby Dee? Cats is always asking me about him?

GWT: He is living out in Florida. Dot and Kev are doing their thing. Whip is back and forth to New York coming from Detroit. We were supposed to go on tour with KRS1, but the paper work didn’t fall through.

TS: So how do you feel about this Federation of Hip Hop that DJ Yoda, Bam, Lucky Strike, Caz, Kurtis Blow, Peeblee Poo and so many others are a part of, to make Hip Hop a better situation?

GWT: Oh yeah man, of course that was long over due. I know about it and I fully support them. What ever they need me to do. All they have to do is let me know.

TS: Before we conclude this where do you see Hip Hop going today as far as the 50 Cent, and all those other guys that represent Hip Hop in the mainstream?

GWT: I see people are able to recognize what Rap and what Hip Hop are today. I think it is getting to the point where people are rapping about violence and stuff like that, that it is getting to the point where the record company’s don’t want to sign anybody unless they been shot or stabbed…..

TS: (starts chuckling.) Yeah right, make your bones.

GWT: And I hope it goes back to you know peace, love, and having fun.

TS: Exactly, but you don’t see it in that direction just yet?

GWT: No.

TS: Who do you like today that is making music?

GWT: I like Common, the Dead Prez, Mos Def.

TS: So you like the guys that are not talking whatsoever about violence but concise and positive Hip Hop?

GWT: Yeah I like that kind of Rap where you can learn from it. I like Kanye West. I don’t like some of the things he says publicly. Far as if you hate the President of the United States, and saying that the President doesn’t like Black people, keep that to yourself.

TS: Why do you feel he should keep that to himself?

GWT: Because talking about isn’t going to make it any better, it is going to make it worse.

TS: So you are saying show some action?

GWT: Exactly.

TS: I hear that, I like that part you said.

GWT: I mean Master P pretty much said the same thing. I talked to him and he said you can’t say the President don’t like Black people. We all know that there is racism in this country. Everybody knows that, so he is not saying anything that we don’t already know.

TS: But you don’t think that maybe sometimes somebody needs to say something to let the politicians know that we are not asleep over here and we are still angry? You don’t think just looking at it two ways that could have serve something good?

GWT: I just feel that if Kanye West wasn’t in the position that he is in, that he wouldn’t have said what he said. And me and his DJ is real cool.

TS: What’s his DJ’s name?

GWT: A-Trak, whenever I go to the West Coast we end up hanging out together.

This concludes this interview. Theodore, thank you for your time. When you get a chance please go to oldschoolhiphop.com click on the message board. They helped contribute to this interview also, they have a lot of respect for you and your craft. Peace to my man JayQuan because he also contributed to the interview.

Peace Troy. Thank you also.

Peace and blessings to you family. praise God and God bless you.

Troy L. from HARLEM,

 

[waterproof]

Grand Wizard Theodore & The Fantastic Romantic 5 'Can I Get A Soul Clapp' (Soul-O-Wax 1981)

 

[waterproof]