Spoken Into Existence

[alissowack]

You mind if I borrow this?

I'm teaching a class later, on White-Racist's Rehab, and I still have a few students 'in denial' it seems.

Sure, I don't mind.

 

[VIBE]

Everything exists, there's no denying those things you listed. I don't think people 'deny existence' but just deny self instead, they're afraid to confront life as it is or the way they are. To ignore fact is to live guilt free. Because they'll state it does exists within others, but not themselves so they do not deny existence but self.

I dunno if that's what you mean, because your title is misleading a little then your post is about the existence of things in our lives (emotions, addictions, etc).

 

[BiblicalAtheist]

You have to think it before you can speak it.

 

[alissowack]

Everything exists, there's no denying those things you listed. I don't think people 'deny existence' but just deny self instead, they're afraid to confront life as it is or the way they are. To ignore fact is to live guilt free. Because they'll state it does exists within others, but not themselves so they do not deny existence but self.

I dunno if that's what you mean, because your title is misleading a little then your post is about the existence of things in our lives (emotions, addictions, etc).

I could be nickpicking but...the self is just a much a part of the existence as well as everything else. There is an importance to not deny self if it is constructive. However, accepting self could be destructive as well. There just might be people that become so consumed by their emotions and addictions to where they are no longer a "person". They become those things. It makes them who they are.

There is also the external stuff like poverty, suffering, injustice and such that if not given the proper light would be destructive.

 

[alissowack]

You have to think it before you can speak it.

Yeah, you're right. What I was kind of going for in this thread is this acceptance or denial aspect to the things that exist. There are a lot of things in life that we face but are not willing to accept that it exist or that it is possible for a particular thing to happen. There are topics in life I believe will never get the light of day because we just don't know how to deal with it. We don't want to have to think about it or we may be considered insane.

 

[KTULU IS BACK]

You have to think it before you can speak it.

then why do so many people have to be reminded to think before they speak?

 

[BiblicalAtheist]

Yeah, you're right. What I was kind of going for in this thread is this acceptance or denial aspect to the things that exist. There are a lot of things in life that we face but are not willing to accept that it exist or that it is possible for a particular thing to happen. There are topics in life I believe will never get the light of day because we just don't know how to deal with it. We don't want to have to think about it or we may be considered insane.

Like what? Bring it to conscious awareness and maybe it will get a firmer reality and people will be 'forced' to deal with it.

then why do so many people have to be reminded to think before they speak?

Clearly because some people spit out the first thought that comes to mind.

 

[alissowack]

You sure people will be forced to face the facts? This is just one and I'm only using to make a point. Child molestation exists. There are many cases of kids being taken advantage of. We think that by punishing the sex offenders or "Datelinin' em" is going make those who would be pedophiles think twice about what they are about to do. It still happens. The perp gets locked up with no regard for what gets them to that point and the vic could go their entire lives unable to voice their tragedy. It is not to glorify the act for the act should be punished. It is to say that these criminals were "people" once. They had issues in life they couldn't answer on their own and was forced to figure it out themselves.

I believe as well that there are some topics that people are just not ready for and in putting it out there recklessly will spark something destructive. It's like someone deciding to start a "pedophile anonymous" thread and expecting it to be met with open arms and understanding.

 

[GSonII]

I don't really get what point you are trying to get over. On the other hand, speaking into existence, claiming it, all seem to be more christian church folk talk. Now if you say that if God spoke and it was and we are made in his image, we can speak and it will be I understand what you are saying, and I understand what the church mean when they say claim it, but it's like you are lying on God when these things don't come true. Kinda why I am not a fan of preachers making prophesies. I think any religious thought you have should end with God. I also think we don't know how God works and all if this is just putting him into a box that he can not be put into. Lastly, Am I the devil if I can only seem to speak negative things into existence? I damn sure have not been able to speak any positives into existence, but may have been able to speak some negatives into existence.

 

[BiblicalAtheist]

You sure people will be forced to face the facts? This is just one and I'm only using to make a point. Child molestation exists. There are many cases of kids being taken advantage of. We think that by punishing the sex offenders or "Datelinin' em" is going make those who would be pedophiles think twice about what they are about to do. It still happens. The perp gets locked up with no regard for what gets them to that point and the vic could go their entire lives unable to voice their tragedy. It is not to glorify the act for the act should be punished. It is to say that these criminals were "people" once. They had issues in life they couldn't answer on their own and was forced to figure it out themselves.

I believe as well that there are some topics that people are just not ready for and in putting it out there recklessly will spark something destructive. It's like someone deciding to start a "pedophile anonymous" thread and expecting it to be met with open arms and understanding.

The more something is consciously aware in 'collective conscious', the less it can be ignored. And people are 'forced' to look at it/deal with it.

What do you mean they were 'people' 'once'?

 

[John Prewett]

Acclaim for NATHAN McCALL’S MAKES ME WANNA HOLLER

“So honest, so well written, so powerful that it will leave you shaken and educated. The book belongs in every prison library and affluent country club.

No one black or white, rich or poor will come away unrewarded." USA Today

"Not since Claude Brown's Manchild in the Promised Land has there been such an honest and searching look

at the perils of growing up a black male in urban America . . . a compelling depiction of the toll that racism and misguided notions

of manhood have taken in the life of one black man and, by implication, many others. - San Francisco Chronicle

"Soul searing…. an unsettling account of the human consequences of an American tragedy." - Time

"Both poignant and disturbing . . . Makes Me Wanna Holler has the feel of a classic . . . . There is value and depth to what [McCall] reveals.

And, above all, there is a two fisted honesty, unflinching in its recognition of the multifaceted dynamic of America's unmitigated neurosis ....

Obscene, fiery, in your face [and] utterly believable." –St Louis Post Dispatch

"With great technical skill and insight, McCall . . . shows the humanity of a population commonly perceived as menacing .... And he offers sane, well reasoned explanations

for why that group seems to be at the center of so much urban distress …..Required reading for anyone interested in American race relations." Philadelphia Inquirer

"Makes Me Wanna Holler will become a modern classic.

It is Manchild in the Promised Land for a new generation." Claude Brown

Nathan McCall grew up in Portsmouth, Virginia. [born around 1955]

He studied journalism at Norfolk State University after serving three years in prison.

He reported for the Virginian Pilot Ledger Star and the Atlanta Journal-Constitution

before moving to The Washington Post in 1989.

Now Prof at Emory University - http://www.nathanmccall.net/

MAKES ME WANNA HOLLER A Young Black Man in America

VINTAGE BOOKS A Division of Random House, Inc. New York

FIRST VINTAGE BOOKS EDITION, FEBRUARY 1995

.... I'm teaching a class later, on White-Racist's Rehab, .........

from pages 3 and 4: begin quote:

While we kicked, he lay there, curled up in the fetal position, trying to use his hands

to cover his head. We bloodied him so badly that I was a little scared and backed off.

The others, seeing how badly he was messed up, moved away too. But one dude kept stomping, like he'd gone berserk.

He seemed crazed and consumed in the pleasure of kicking that white boy's ass.

When he finished, he reached down and picked up the white dude's bike, lifted it as high as he could above his head and slammed it down on him hard.

The white guy didn't even flinch. He was out cold. I feared he might be dead until I saw him breathing.

We walked away, laughing, boasting, competing for bragging rights about who’d done the most damage.

"Man, did you see how red that cracker's face turned when I busted his lip?

I almost broke my hand on that ugly motherfucka!"

Fucking up white boys like that made us feel good inside. I guess we must have been fourteen or fifteen by then, and it felt so good that we stumbled over each other sometimes trying to get in extra kicks and punches. When we bum rushed white boys, it made me feel like we were beating all white people on behalf of all blacks. We called it "gettin' some get back," securing revenge for all the shit they'd heaped on blacks all these years. They were still heaping hell on us, and especially on our parents. The difference was, cats in my generation weren't taking it lying down.

After my older brother Dwight got his driver's license, a group of us would pile into my stepfather's car some evenings and cruise through a nearby white neighborhood, searching for people walking the streets. We'd spot some whites, get out, rush over, and, using sticks and fists, try to beat them to within an inch of their lives. .... end quote

QUESTION: After a White Racist is rehabilitated in your class, is there anything

he can wear so that people with the mentality of the youthful Mr McCall and his gang

will understand he is now cured so that the gang of righteous avengers will leave him alone ?

 

[alissowack]

I don't really get what point you are trying to get over. On the other hand, speaking into existence, claiming it, all seem to be more christian church folk talk. Now if you say that if God spoke and it was and we are made in his image, we can speak and it will be I understand what you are saying, and I understand what the church mean when they say claim it, but it's like you are lying on God when these things don't come true. Kinda why I am not a fan of preachers making prophesies. I think any religious thought you have should end with God. I also think we don't know how God works and all if this is just putting him into a box that he can not be put into. Lastly, Am I the devil if I can only seem to speak negative things into existence? I damn sure have not been able to speak any positives into existence, but may have been able to speak some negatives into existence.

I admit that this is a sketchy thread here. My intentions were really to address existence in general. We may not be able to summon something from the depth of our minds, but it is to say we can give something a name. There are things in life that people face and they either feel ashamed to address or that they are in denial of it. I agree with the "God in a box" response. I try not to get all prophetic and stuff for it's not my place to do so.

 

[alissowack]

The more something is consciously aware in 'collective conscious', the less it can be ignored. And people are 'forced' to look at it/deal with it.

What do you mean they were 'people' 'once'?

You are right, but will that happen? And even if it people know about it, will it's existence be respected or exploited?

What I mean by "people" is that there was a time when these criminals were innocent by association. They were "normal". And now, society has condemned them whether they deserve a second chance or not.

 

[janklow]

Acclaim for NATHAN McCALL’S MAKES ME WANNA HOLLER

it seems pretty clear you have some kind of financial interest in promoting this book

 

[John Prewett]

it seems pretty clear you have some kind of financial interest in promoting this book

It is pretty clear I believe Professor McCall wrote an honest/true and informative account/history of his life [till about age 40,... he's about 55 now].

Of all the quotes from his book, were there any you thought implausible ?

QUESTION: After a White Racist is rehabilitated in your class, is there anything

he can wear so that people with the mentality of the youthful Mr McCall and his gang

will understand he is now cured so that the gang of righteous avengers will leave him alone ?

 

[shootemwon]

Man spoke God into existence.

 

[janklow]

It is pretty clear I believe Professor McCall wrote an honest/true and informative account/history of his life [till about age 40,... he's about 55 now]. Of all the quotes from his book, were there any you thought implausible ?

pretty sure it's clear my comment is based around your constant referencing of the book, not any specific quote. try and keep up

QUESTION: After a White Racist is rehabilitated in your class, is there anything

he can wear so that people with the mentality of the youthful Mr McCall and his gang

will understand he is now cured so that the gang of righteous avengers will leave him alone ?

i am assuming this question is for someone else?