Did God of the Bible use Trial and Error?

[BiblicalAtheist]

Vibe(I'm pretty sure it's Vibe) has some interesting thoughts on the all knowing-ness of god, hope he steps in here and shares his thoughts.

 

[ThaChozenWun]

Yes, he used trial in error. Vibe will drop the all knowingness stuff, but yes it was trial and error.

A god that has no wrong is the mirror image of perfection simply fucked up and wasn't perfect.

 

[universaltruth]

Yes, he used trial in error. Vibe will drop the all knowingness stuff, but yes it was trial and error.

A god that has no wrong is the mirror image of perfection simply fucked up and wasn't perfect.

Definatly this, the way the Bible, especially the Old Testament shows god is more the writers own perspective on god more then the actual truth of things

 

[VIBE]

I read the bible and try to make it a part of my daily life but like anything that has not been totally proven I have my questions and concerns on the way it is being taught, religion and Christianity that is. Most of my questions don't lie with the bible they lie with people and there perceptions, ways of explaining things, it sometime feels like people can't except things for what they are and have to resort to making stuff up.

Moving on, Genesis 6 Chapter verses 5-7. These verses basically speak on how God saw that man was wicked so he decided to destroy them the 1st time with the flood with the exception of Noah his crew of animals and creatures and so on. So, my question is if God is this all-knowing perfect spirit why did he have to use what we would call Trial and Error? Why did he have to try something see that it did not work out the way he would like then go to a second option and basically destroy it?

Lastly, I choose to believe in a higher being or a creator that we refer to as God and I must admit that I have no clue rather I am 100% correct or not it is just faith and I am glad to have some measure of it. Be blessed and bless each other.

Well, I guess we would have to lie on the idea that God is imperfect? I mean as a believer that sucks to hear, see or say right? How dare anyone say that. But there's instances in the bible that I've come across that seem to show God as a not all knowing being.

We can start off and nail the top things that is said to be known by God.

1. Thoughts/thinking: Clearly in the bible it's said God knows our thoughts/what were thinking. If you really think about it, your thought is always current. So God is just basically a mind reader. He reads your current state, which leads to all the other things...

2. Knows where you're going, what you're going to do: A thought is used to execute these things, so in that light it seems God knows it before you do but really he doesn't. Just because you haven't arrived to McDonalds, doesn't mean God magically knew. He had seen a thought, which is how you both know lol

3. Knows the words before they exit your mouth: Again, it's a thought before you say. Everyone thinks, then speaks. It's such a split second time between that though it doesn't seem like we even think then speak. Again, God is reading a CURRENT thought. Which is how he is able to "know your words beforehand".

That's just a few, and it all normally resorts back to the thought. Also being that God see's everything, that's how he knows where we are all at.

Also, the supreme knowledge of God is given to him because God "knows his creation and the end times". Well think about that. It's normal for a creator to know what he has created, to know the details, specs, numbers, functions, outcome etc. Being a creator, you have the power to end it as well. God simply knows the creation because he's the creator and knows the end because he is the creator.

It's like if I create a sand castle; I know how many towers I've built, I know how long it took, I know how many shells I've used, I know how many cups of water I've used for the moat, I know how big it is etc. I'm the creator, I took my time and created this thing. Now I know it's end time as well, I know I will destroy it before I leave the beach.

Nothing special about that.

Now I brought all those up before I brought up my things that show God isn't all knowing. (in case you try to use them later here)

Using Genesis first, your asked about verses.

Genesis 6

5 The LORD saw how great man's wickedness on the earth had become, and that every inclination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil all the time.
6 The LORD was grieved that he had made man on the earth, and his heart was filled with pain.
7 So the LORD said, "I will wipe mankind, whom I have created, from the face of the earth—men and animals, and creatures that move along the ground, and birds of the air—for I am grieved that I have made them."

This shows that God isn't all knowing. If he was, then the verse should show he expected it in some way. It doesn't. It shows us he is grieved, heart filled with pain, he's sorry he even made them. This is only ONE instance where he shows he didn't know this was going to happen.

Another instance was when God asked Abraham to kill his son Issac. Remember, they took a journey to this place God told him about. This was a 3 day journey. When Abraham arrived and built the alter he got ready to sacrifice his ONLY SON ISSAC to God then God stops him...

12 "Do not lay a hand on the boy," he said. "Do not do anything to him. Now I know that you fear God, because you have not withheld from me your son, your only son."

I found the key words here interesting, "NOW I KNOW YOU FEAR GOD". Which means what? He didn't before. Now if he did, why say it that way? He only knew at that instant. He traveled 3 days to this place and God didn't know.

Also, a verse when God was hearing the outcry about Sodom and Gomorrah.

20 Then the LORD said, "The outcry against Sodom and Gomorrah is so great and their sin so grievous 21 that I will go down and see if what they have done is as bad as the outcry that has reached me. If not, I will know."

God has to come down to earth himself, or send angels whichever, and see if it's as bad as it's being made out to be, THEN he will know. Which means, again, at this current time he doesn't know the extent of sin in Sodom and Gomorrah.

Those instances show us that God ISN'T all knowing. I mean it still shows God as powerful though. Reading minds, being able to tell you your whole past, what you're thinking, what your heart is etc. That still is a big deal, but what I've said for some (or many really) really brings down God as God. God himself never said anything of these sorts, the men in the bible did. They said he was all knowing, they made him that way. I've yet to find an instant where God says this himself.

Hope that sort of helps you...

 

[GSonII]

Well, I guess we would have to lie on the idea that God is imperfect? I mean as a believer that sucks to hear, see or say right? How dare anyone say that. But there's instances in the bible that I've come across that seem to show God as a not all knowing being.

We can start off and nail the top things that is said to be known by God.

1. Thoughts/thinking: Clearly in the bible it's said God knows our thoughts/what were thinking. If you really think about it, your thought is always current. So God is just basically a mind reader. He reads your current state, which leads to all the other things...

2. Knows where you're going, what you're going to do: A thought is used to execute these things, so in that light it seems God knows it before you do but really he doesn't. Just because you haven't arrived to McDonalds, doesn't mean God magically knew. He had seen a thought, which is how you both know lol

3. Knows the words before they exit your mouth: Again, it's a thought before you say. Everyone thinks, then speaks. It's such a split second time between that though it doesn't seem like we even think then speak. Again, God is reading a CURRENT thought. Which is how he is able to "know your words beforehand".

That's just a few, and it all normally resorts back to the thought. Also being that God see's everything, that's how he knows where we are all at.

Also, the supreme knowledge of God is given to him because God "knows his creation and the end times". Well think about that. It's normal for a creator to know what he has created, to know the details, specs, numbers, functions, outcome etc. Being a creator, you have the power to end it as well. God simply knows the creation because he's the creator and knows the end because he is the creator.

It's like if I create a sand castle; I know how many towers I've built, I know how long it took, I know how many shells I've used, I know how many cups of water I've used for the moat, I know how big it is etc. I'm the creator, I took my time and created this thing. Now I know it's end time as well, I know I will destroy it before I leave the beach.

Nothing special about that.

Now I brought all those up before I brought up my things that show God isn't all knowing. (in case you try to use them later here)

Using Genesis first, your asked about verses.

Genesis 6

5 The LORD saw how great man's wickedness on the earth had become, and that every inclination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil all the time.

6 The LORD was grieved that he had made man on the earth, and his heart was filled with pain.

7 So the LORD said, "I will wipe mankind, whom I have created, from the face of the earth—men and animals, and creatures that move along the ground, and birds of the air—for I am grieved that I have made them."

This shows that God isn't all knowing. If he was, then the verse should show he expected it in some way. It doesn't. It shows us he is grieved, heart filled with pain, he's sorry he even made them. This is only ONE instance where he shows he didn't know this was going to happen.

Another instance was when God asked Abraham to kill his son Issac. Remember, they took a journey to this place God told him about. This was a 3 day journey. When Abraham arrived and built the alter he got ready to sacrifice his ONLY SON ISSAC to God then God stops him...

12 "Do not lay a hand on the boy," he said. "Do not do anything to him. Now I know that you fear God, because you have not withheld from me your son, your only son."

I found the key words here interesting, "NOW I KNOW YOU FEAR GOD". Which means what? He didn't before. Now if he did, why say it that way? He only knew at that instant. He traveled 3 days to this place and God didn't know.

Also, a verse when God was hearing the outcry about Sodom and Gomorrah.

20 Then the LORD said, "The outcry against Sodom and Gomorrah is so great and their sin so grievous 21 that I will go down and see if what they have done is as bad as the outcry that has reached me. If not, I will know."

God has to come down to earth himself, or send angels whichever, and see if it's as bad as it's being made out to be, THEN he will know. Which means, again, at this current time he doesn't know the extent of sin in Sodom and Gomorrah.

Those instances show us that God ISN'T all knowing. I mean it still shows God as powerful though. Reading minds, being able to tell you your whole past, what you're thinking, what your heart is etc. That still is a big deal, but what I've said for some (or many really) really brings down God as God. God himself never said anything of these sorts, the men in the bible did. They said he was all knowing, they made him that way. I've yet to find an instant where God says this himself.

Hope that sort of helps you...

Yeah it helps that someone is not trying to make it out to be something that it is not.

 

[VIBE]

Yeah it helps that someone is not trying to make it out to be something that it is not.

Where do you stand on this?

 

[GSonII]

Where do you stand on this?

Only a imperfect being or spirit uses trial and error. There is nowhere else to stand with the brain of a mortal human being. Now if I were a spirit that has never come to earth maybe I would think differently. Lastly, as I stated in the OP I really don't have a problem with the bible though. It reads how it reads. I just don't believe in making things up and the way it reads is that trial and error was used by a spirit that most would want you to believe is perfect, but I still have a measure of faith and hope and a lot of love for humans because we are all in similar situations

 

[GSonII]

I have to add just because the Bible could be a farce at worst and not 100% accurate most likely that does not mean that God does not exist.

 

[toktaylor]

I have to add just because the Bible could be a farce at worst and not 100% accurate most likely that does not mean that God does not exist.

Exactly..the bible is just man's attempt at recording what he was told or what he saw. With todays technology people have seen and recorded many things and yet we find ways to ridicule them so imagine someone in the past trying to record events without cameras and videos. The fact that we find holes in many of the stories does not mean that there is no GOD, in fact what it means is that their experiences were so fantastic they were impulsed to record it.

 

[ThaChozenWun]

Exactly..the bible is just man's attempt at recording what he was told or what he saw. With todays technology people have seen and recorded many things and yet we find ways to ridicule them so imagine someone in the past trying to record events without cameras and videos. The fact that we find holes in many of the stories does not mean that there is no GOD, in fact what it means is that their experiences were so fantastic they were impulsed to record it.

But saying that God created a group that was not perfect and had to wipe them out isn't man trying to interpret it. That would had to have been directly influenced by God. Meaning he is imperfect.

The bible being a full of shit book also doesn't dismiss that a God like being exists.

 

[toktaylor]

But saying that God created a group that was not perfect and had to wipe them out isn't man trying to interpret it. That would had to have been directly influenced by God. Meaning he is imperfect.

The bible being a full of shit book also doesn't dismiss that a God like being exists.

i personally dont think that the flood was a world wide event...science has proven that that there is evidence that suggest that some part of the earth was flooded. The author or Noah only knew of the world as where they were living at the time, so that story might be greatly exaggerated.

 

[ThaChozenWun]

i personally dont think that the flood was a world wide event...science has proven that that there is evidence that suggest that some part of the earth was flooded. The author or Noah only knew of the world as where they were living at the time, so that story might be greatly exaggerated.

Or the black sea flooded and they just didn't have any other explanation at that time so attributed it to a supernatural event.

 

[VIBE]

i personally dont think that the flood was a world wide event...science has proven that that there is evidence that suggest that some part of the earth was flooded. The author or Noah only knew of the world as where they were living at the time, so that story might be greatly exaggerated.

Exactly, it was the "world" to them, as far as they could see. Also, the animals (if ever collected) were collected in his area. Not the worlds.

 

[GSonII]

i personally dont think that the flood was a world wide event...science has proven that that there is evidence that suggest that some part of the earth was flooded. The author or Noah only knew of the world as where they were living at the time, so that story might be greatly exaggerated.

Could be correct but doesn't that kind of lesson the significance of the bible to say that most of these things only applied to a really restricted group of people. That would kinda lesson God's power IMO.

 

[ThaChozenWun]

Why didn't you refer him/her to me? I know stuff! Let me sum it up.

The creator, I am that I am, told me, Ether-I-am, that there is not mistakes i.e. It is what is what it is. Good, bad, evil and all.

Chozen and Ether, it's like Gods Batman and Robin.

God told me Im Chozen to win
He told him he is Ether...

Y'all that keep praying at get nothing LAUCE!!!. LMAO UMAD!

 

[BiblicalAtheist]

Why didn't you refer him/her to me? I know stuff!

Cuz I.... well.... I mean.... it's just that... idk : (

 

[shootemwon]

Isn't it strange that God sometimes gets angry in the Old Testament, then? If he knew everything that happened before it happened, why was he so emotional about it?

 

[alissowack]

I read the bible and try to make it a part of my daily life but like anything that has not been totally proven I have my questions and concerns on the way it is being taught, religion and Christianity that is. Most of my questions don't lie with the bible they lie with people and there perceptions, ways of explaining things, it sometime feels like people can't except things for what they are and have to resort to making stuff up.

Moving on, Genesis 6 Chapter verses 5-7. These verses basically speak on how God saw that man was wicked so he decided to destroy them the 1st time with the flood with the exception of Noah his crew of animals and creatures and so on. So, my question is if God is this all-knowing perfect spirit why did he have to use what we would call Trial and Error? Why did he have to try something see that it did not work out the way he would like then go to a second option and basically destroy it?

Lastly, I choose to believe in a higher being or a creator that we refer to as God and I must admit that I have no clue rather I am 100% correct or not it is just faith and I am glad to have some measure of it. Be blessed and bless each other.

I don't believe it to be trial and error in respect to God. I could be wrong, but my idea of trial and error is that you go with what you think works. If the result is wrong, you start completely over; no survivors. Even if there is some hint of progress, if it isn't 100%, you start over. Why make this exception of just having Noah and family live?

 

[VIBE]

I don't believe it to be trial and error in respect to God. I could be wrong, but my idea of trial and error is that you go with what you think works. If the result is wrong, you start completely over; no survivors. Even if there is some hint of progress, if it isn't 100%, you start over. Why make this exception of just having Noah and family live?

Well being that all were living 'wicked' in their ways, God found to destroy them ALL. BUT God found Noah, pretty much a being in God's eyes that was "pure" so to say. So IMO God felt a pure one could re-populate the world and I guess be pure from him??

Trail and error still.

 

[alissowack]

Well being that all were living 'wicked' in their ways, God found to destroy them ALL. BUT God found Noah, pretty much a being in God's eyes that was "pure" so to say. So IMO God felt a pure one could re-populate the world and I guess be pure from him??

Trail and error still.

Noah was not pure. He was, from mankind's standpoint, no different from the so-called wicked. He was still a product of man (Adam and Eve to be specific) and should have met the fate of everyone else. And even if the argument for trial and error lingers on, Noah's lineage didn't produce the most "innocent" people either as a result of "starting over". Why not even take it back to Adam and Eve...wipe them out and start over? That would have been the best place to start.